CBS 58 OTA Audio Crackling

[guck11]

Hello Everyone!

I am new to this site and relatively new to the HD world.  I recently got in on the CC deal a few weeks back for the Vizio 50" Plasma w/ built in tuner.  So far over the air has been great, with the exception of CBS 58.  No matter what HD sporting event they display, they is at times audio crackling to the point it sounds like a blow speaker.  I know this is not the case, as all other channels OTA as well as analog cable fed from VCR tuner as well as DVD movies and music played through TV speakers all sound great.  I have tried everything to replicate this crackling with multiple different feeds and nothing will do it, only HD CBS 58 shows.  When OTA CBS 58 airs something not in HD format, the audio is fine as well.  Oh and the other night I turned The Unit on, and this had the audio crackling.  On sports and now this show, the crackling seems to only happen when the show or sports game goes to a loud level ( i.e. crowd cheers real loud, announcer talks at loud level, ... ).  Once again NBC, FOX, ABC all play loud audio on HD shows with no problem.

I have one of the roof fold out style antennas up in my attic pointing NE.  I live on the west side of milwaukee, and feel I should not have any reception problems.

Is anyone else experiencing audio crackling from CBS 58 HD shows?  Any suggestions as to what my problem may be?  Is it low signal or does CBS 58 OTA just plain suck?


Thanks in advance!

[RCNUT]

Hello,
   I too hear a problem with CBS, but not cracks but audio drops in 5.1HD.  However I hate to say this but I also hear in in the CBS East coast feed. I still have not ruled out the upgrade that *D* did for there 10-250 HD DVR's. Ever since they did that back in Oct.06 I have had issues with not only audio (5.1 only) but lock ups on the OTA part of the receiver. Of coarse D claims they have had not problem.
Good luck!

[DanDyer]

Guck,
From what I have read, you have problems only with the HD (full screen 16x9) signals, correct?  If this is so, I highly advise checking your system again.  It sounds (no pun intended) like your amplifier is being overdriven.  
The audio for CBS HD programming is fed to us as Dolby E.  We use CBS specified equipment and settings to get the Dolby signal to the viewers.  We have changed the volume setting (dialog normal setting) specified by CBS down 15 db lower than what CBS calls for, due to the audio being overbearingly loud (hair blown backwards loud).  I do know that even with the levels previously that high, the signal was crystal clear.  
We do get an occasional problem with our upconverted signal of scratchy or hissing audio once in a while, where we then have to reboot the CBS Dolby equipment, yet we usually catch that before the general viewers really can hear it.
Dan Dyer
Chief Engineer WDJT

[Gregg Lengling]

Hello Everyone!

I am new to this site and relatively new to the HD world.  I recently got in on the CC deal a few weeks back for the Vizio 50" Plasma w/ built in tuner.  So far over the air has been great, with the exception of CBS 58.  No matter what HD sporting event they display, they is at times audio crackling to the point it sounds like a blow speaker.  I know this is not the case, as all other channels OTA as well as analog cable fed from VCR tuner as well as DVD movies and music played through TV speakers all sound great.  I have tried everything to replicate this crackling with multiple different feeds and nothing will do it, only HD CBS 58 shows.  When OTA CBS 58 airs something not in HD format, the audio is fine as well.  Oh and the other night I turned The Unit on, and this had the audio crackling.  On sports and now this show, the crackling seems to only happen when the show or sports game goes to a loud level ( i.e. crowd cheers real loud, announcer talks at loud level, ... ).  Once again NBC, FOX, ABC all play loud audio on HD shows with no problem.

I have one of the roof fold out style antennas up in my attic pointing NE.  I live on the west side of milwaukee, and feel I should not have any reception problems.

Is anyone else experiencing audio crackling from CBS 58 HD shows?  Any suggestions as to what my problem may be?  Is it low signal or does CBS 58 OTA just plain suck?


Thanks in advance!

I've noticed recently that there is distortion in the CBS 58 digital audio feed.  I guess I'll listen to analog 58 tonight and see if it's the same.  Very noticeable on the Jeopardy theme during final jeopardy.

[Nels Harvey]

Guck,

The audio for CBS HD programming is fed to us as Dolby E.  We use CBS specified equipment and settings to get the Dolby signal to the viewers.  We have changed the volume setting (dialog normal setting) specified by CBS down 15 db lower than what CBS calls for, due to the audio being overbearingly loud (hair blown backwards loud).  I do know that even with the levels previously that high, the signal was crystal clear.  

Dan Dyer
Chief Engineer WDJT

I still find WDJT DT audio levels higher than the other OTA digital stations, though not as bad as it was when a previous thread appeared on this site.  It sounds like Guck11's  receiving equipment may have a headroom problem that the other stations are not hitting, so the problem isn't noted with them.

Headroom is the term used when the audio level exceeds the capabilities of the amplifier by being higher than the circuit's power supply's ability to provide fidelity on voice, or other sound peaks

Examine the whole audio receiving chain to see if one input is set too high, with another input turned down to compensate.  Try other audio connections if possible to see if the problem remains.  Experimentation can often find the cause of such problems.  Guck11, I do wish you well.

Nels....

[guck11]

Guck,
From what I have read, you have problems only with the HD (full screen 16x9) signals, correct?  If this is so, I highly advise checking your system again.  It sounds (no pun intended) like your amplifier is being overdriven.  

Yes problem is in HD full screen shows only, but when 58 broadcasts on that same channel a show that is not HD full screen, audio is totally fine.  For example say CBS broadcasted an NFL game in HD format, I would then get the cracklin/popping noise but if the game, ( for example this past Sundays first game was in 4:3 format ), the audio would be just fine.  Once again this is only OTA, I do not have TWC.

I have not tried running the audio signal out of my TV to my receiver yet, this problem is only occurring on the Plasmas internal speakers.

As stated it is a Vizio P50HDTV10A 50" Plasma with Integrated NTSC/ATSC/QAM HDTV Tuner and SRS ® TruSurround® XT Speakers capable of Dolby Digital 5.1.  I tried playing with the audio settings turning off Dobly Digital and still same crackling on channel 58.  I have played movies and music through the TVs speakers at loud volumes, and the speakers sound great for TV, so I believe that the TV amp can handle a high load.

Here is a side note, when the HD shows on 58 are playing, I still get that crackling/popping noise even when I turn the volume way down on the TV.  So it does not matter what level I have the volume at on the TV, I still get the same problem.

[guck11]

Dan Dyer

Ok, so last night I turned on CSI about 15 minutes after it had already started and I noticed the crackling popping noise.  It was especially bad when the HD Best Buy commercial came on.  Then when CSI came back on, a few minutes in, my TV made a flicker almost as if someone cut the feed and brought it back a second later, ( and to answer the question it was not the standard blip in digital reception you sometimes get that is pixelated.  This was like the feed was pulled and brought back a second later. )  It could be coincidence, but after that, the audio appeared to be fine.  No crackling or popping noise even at peaks of higher audio.  I did not have a chance to watch Shark in HD cause I left, but I plan to watch a televised HD sporting event on CBS this Saturday or Sunday to see if the crackling/popping audio is there as it is extremely horrible on sports telecasts in HD.

Also some more info for you, someone else I know has a Sony LCD w/built in tuner also grabbing HD channels OTA via antenna.  When they watch a show in HD on 4, 6, or 12 the audio level is fine, but when they switch to a HD show on 58 the audio level is about 50% higher and has to turn the volume way down to keep it at a normal listening level.

Both my TV and the Sony are using the TV's speakers, not an external receiver.

[StarvingForHDTV]

Dan Dyer

Also some more info for you, someone else I know has a Sony LCD w/built in tuner also grabbing HD channels OTA via antenna.  When they watch a show in HD on 4, 6, or 12 the audio level is fine, but when they switch to a HD show on 58 the audio level is about 50% higher and has to turn the volume way down to keep it at a normal listening level.

I get the same thing.  When I switch from NFL on Fox to NFL on CBS I have to adjust the volume quite a bit.  CBS has a very high audio level feed.

Also the OTA programming guide is gone again.

[guck11]

Update:

Watched the 3:00pm NFL game on CBS yesterday and the audio, for the first time, was fine the entire game.  No crackling or popping to report.

[DanDyer]

Guck,
That's interesting because last night during 60 Minutes, our Dolby system started it's symptom of needing to be rebooted.  We have rebooted the system this morning.  
Dan Dyer

[VoidXero]

Guck,
That's interesting because last night during 60 Minutes, our Dolby system started it's symptom of needing to be rebooted.  We have rebooted the system this morning.  
Dan Dyer

That problem made 60 minutes unwatchable for me. I guess I could have switched to the SD feed but I rarely venture below 504 if I can help it.

[guck11]

Guck,
That's interesting because last night during 60 Minutes, our Dolby system started it's symptom of needing to be rebooted.  We have rebooted the system this morning.  
Dan Dyer

 
 
You know what, I do remember switching on 60 minutes about 20 minutes after the game and the SD audio did sound really bad, but it was not a crackling popping issue.  It sounded more like interference of some sort.  I did not pay too much attention to it as I was not watching the show.  To restate, the audio during the entire game had no problems.

Last night I turned on How I Met Your Mother and the audio sounded great through the TV speakers.  I finally received my optical cables and hooked the TV up to the external receiver and that sounded good as well.

Have you guys done anything different with audio?  I am curious now why HD audio has been ok now.  ( at least it has since I posted about watching CSI on Thurs. )

[guck11]

Crackling Still there!
 
Ok, after testing various ways, I have come to the conclusion that the crackling is due to CBS 58 OTA outputing their "Dolby Digital 5.1" signal at too high a level.

I have tried listening via TV speakers as well as outputting to a high-end receiver.  The TV is really bad, and the receiver has noticeable crackling.

My receiver automatically displays on screen what signal it is receiving ( ProLogic II, Dolby Digital, or DTS ).  When CBS 58 OTA is broadasting a signal in Dolby Digital, the crackling is noticeable at higher levels or say spikes in volume.  For example, when watching football and the crowd cheers really loud or the announcer screams at a play, you can hear the crackling.  When the signal is detected as ProLogic II, the audio is fine and there is no crackling ( certain parts of an HD broadcast detect as ProLogic II such as certain commercials or when the show comes back it may stay ProLogic II for a little while ).

The only thing I can compare it to is like when I bring an mp3 into an audio editing program and increase the volume decible level.  When it is spiking in the Red meter level I get the a crackling noise.

I think to correct this, the Dolby Digital signal needs to be output at a lower decible level.

To prove it is not my TV or receiver, when FOX, NBC, or ABC broadcast a Dolby Digital Signal, I do not get the crackling noise on either.  Once again my receiver is smart enough to change the text on the receiver display and state what type of signal it is receiving, so I know when those other stations are broadcasting a Dolby Digital signal.

I am not the only one to complain that CBS 58 OTA volume is way higher than the other channels HD broadcasts.  So why not lower the volume say another few decibles.

[Nels Harvey]

I still am receiving Ch. 58 HD audio very much louder than the other local stations over the air.  curiously, the local, SD spots and weather bits audio comes through at about normal levels!  Then, the network audio comes through several db higher!

Ch. 4, 6, and 12 HD audio levels are very close to each other, and are very close to what my SD tuner detects as well.  But when I go to Ch. 58, and step up to the HD, there is a marked difference.  Also, watching Numbers last night, the Numbers bumper audio is especially high as it is, and going from the weather bump to the HD feed was especially annoying to me!

Am I the only one experiencing this difference in audio levels from station to station?

Nels....

[jeffski]

I have same problem here. Whether I watch it on 505 or 5 , the audio is quite a bit louder. My dad ,who has basic cable without a cable box, has the same problem. Why is this and why won't they fix it? It's obviously a TWC issue because when I watch it over the air on 58.1 , it's fine. :bang: