Journal Sentinal Sunday December 8

[mcq]

 

Originally posted by ReesR:
"But is all this enough to justify plunking down a couple thousand bucks just to have a clearer view through that window?"

Those of us who have made the investment are overjoyed by what it provides.

Rees

We paid $5000 for new clearer windows....

I do want to cut Tim some slack. I just wish he would show up once in a while and engage in some lively conversation. Maybe he's just too busy?

All in all, I would have to admit, that I am 100% envious of him! Who wouldn't want to watch TV (especially HDTV)for a living. Yeah that's it for me..."Once again jealousy rears it's ugly head!" And to think I use to laugh at the MassComm geeks as I walked to my Argumentation and Debate class in Merril Hall.
   



[This message has been edited by mcq (edited 12-10-2002).]

[Matt Heebner]

I have to agree with some of the above posters. I am very glad that Tim C. is getting into the HD "way of life" and I am very glad that he is doing an article that, up till today, was pretty good and at the very least is getting HD "out there". But....

Todays installment was flawed. I understand that we are kind of "following" his journey in HD Land with TWC, but I thought the purpose of the article was to inform readers what is availible BE IT on cable, satellite, and OTA. He should have talked about what's available on TWC, but then also made mention of CBS(I mean come on, this is a local OTA broadcasting station with the most programming of all the networks and it didn't even get a mention??), HDNet, DiscoveryHD, etc. He could have said that even though TWC doesnt yet offer these channels, they do have possible plans for the future.
I think the biggest flaw of his article was that he did not include what those stations have already broadcast(Olympics, NCAA play-offs, college football etc) and what they have already announced for the future like the  FREAKIN SUPERBOWL, Monday Night Football, more NCAA Play-offs, possible NFL play-off games (CBS). What beter way to get the masses interested by taunting them with what's ahead!!!
I dont think he should judge for others whether or not the price of all this is worth it, but rather present ALL the facts and evidence, and let people decide for themselves. I will bet dollars to doughnuts all it would take for some people is HD football and Bikini Destinations, and they'll be hooked for life!!
Anyways, I look forward to the "verdict" article tomorrow.

Matt

[tenth_t2]

Overall, I'd say a good set of articles.  As one of the original "dirty dozen" we've seen a lot of progress in the past year here in Milwaukee.  And the top billing under "On the web" section certainly doesn't hurt!

It's been one heck of a year...

Greg O.

[Matt Heebner]

Dirty Dozen...thats a good one.  

Matt

[mcq]

Can I be Victor Franco (John Cassavetes)??

[RRP]

I read part IV of TC's series and I have to agree with his conclusion.  The price is still pretty steep and after putzing around with my antenna for over a week I still can't get all channels broadcasting(living in Shorewood).
My take on when to get in?: When any 3 of the following four events occur:

*  When all local stations are broadcasting at full power (ahhm, 6,18,24)

*  When all HD channels are available on cable and perhaps Satellite.

*  When at least one HD sporting event is shown per weekend and primetime HD programming reaches 75%

* Prices fall another 25%

My estimate as too when this will happen?  Sept. 2003 (New fall season and I predict HD NFL each Sunday like FOX does it now: A&B games.)

Note: I'm totally talking out of my a-- and have no basis for my conclusions!  

[This message has been edited by RRP (edited 12-11-2002).]

[mr_yeti]

I think the most important thing to consider here is what I like to call the "futz factor." OTA reception requires a fair amount of trial-and-error, and a reasonable degree of technical ability, not to mention the expense of the box and antenna. Granted, the programming is free when the initial investment is made, but many people would be unwilling to go through all this trouble and expense to receive (at the current time) 4.1 channels.

For example: my parents recently bought their first DVD player. I stopped by their house shortly after they purchased it, and the were complaining that it didn't work. Now, before I reveal what the problem was, I must point out that these are both educated people with degrees from our state schools. They're just not so savvy with electronics.

They had the audio and video wires running from the output on their DVD player to the output on their TV. The connections look they same, they reasoned, so why not just plug them in? Do these people sound like they're ready to take on the occasionally daunting task of receiving OTA HD?

The solution: make HDTV truly plug-and-play, and get some sporting events worth watching. Disney's plan to air all of the major sports championships (aside from baseball, of course. We'll NEVER see that.) in HD is a start, and MNF will be great next season. This will make people hungry for more.

[Gregg Lengling]

I think because it's been so long since TV first started that no-one seems to remember what it took to receive TV back in the  40's and 50's and just for 1, 2 or 3 stations.  Everyone invested (almost everyone who didn't want a lot of ghosting) in an outdoor antenna, then I remember having to buy a STB...yes a STB...actually it was a UHF receiver/tuner that down-converted to channel 2 or 3 on your TV so you could receive those new UHF stations.

If you are investing $600 or more..what is an extra $100.00 for antenna/mount/coax and a couple hours of time.  Maybe we're getting to be a lazier society and want to spend $300.00 to have the antenna installed, but when I was a kid I watched all the fathers in the neighborhood on the weekend, one time or another, up on the roof putting a TV antenna up.

Actually if you want to keep up with the Joneses, a TV antenna or Satellite dish is the cats meow nowadays.



------------------
Gregg R. Lengling
RCA P61310 61" 16x9
(Built in DTC100 w/Directv)
HiDTV Pro 2 computer reciever card
glengling@ameritech.net

[veyj]

Part IV - http://www.jsonline.com/enter/tvradio/dec02/102290.asp

Too funny.  You can stop looking Rees.  I like how Tim doesn't use THE word, but he certainly couldn't resist quoting:

Bromberg - "I might be saying something differently a year or two from now, but I haven't gone out and bought one myself. I think we really are still in the experimental stage."

Steinmetz - "It's a sign that we're still very much in a transition to a new technology. There's experimenting and testing going on."


I was pleasantly surprised to see Tim writing on the subject of HDTV.  For what's it's worth, I'll take some exposure over no exposure.

PS - Meow, Meow Gregg

[This message has been edited by veyj (edited 12-11-2002).]

[RRP]

Yes lummox, we've become a lazier society that demands convience and rightly so.  I like tinkering with my HT setup up to a point but this antenna thing has put me just about over the edge. I've been reluctant to put my antenna on my roof because 1) I'm only 2-4 miles from most of the transmitters and 2) It just looks bad  

PS: It might be the cats meow, but my little kitten (wife) wouldn't be purring if I had put that thing on the roof    


[This message has been edited by RRP (edited 12-11-2002).]

[mr_yeti]

Notice that these people installing antennas (antennai?) on their roofs did so BEFORE they had television to watch? After the antenna is installed, you just sit on the couch and watch. That was the beginning. Now we don't need to do even that much anymore. The cable or satellite installer shows up and does the work for us. In my case, it involved working LESS, since I took half a day off of work for the occasion.

Television = incitement to laziness, physical and otherwise. Expecting people to be as industrious as they were in getting a signal initially when easier choices abound for receiving numerous channels, albiet of poorer quality than HD, is unrealistic.

Getting HDTV must be easy and low in cost before it can become viable.

[mcq]

Darn it Tim, I was just starting to warm up to you. I am sorry but you lost all credibility with me after Part IV. It's become obvious that in general, when it comes to HDTV you have not checked your facts and/or you have some sort of agenda. Get with the program (inappropriate language and namecalling deleted)!

CBS SHINES IN HDTV, SAYS ACADEMY OF DTV PIONEERS CBS, HDNet and House Commerce Committee Chairman Billy Tauzin Claim Top Honors at 2001 Academy of DTV Pioneers Awards Washington, D.C., April 25,  www.CE.org


"CBS, the first television network to broadcast the majority of its primetime schedule in HD, was rewarded with three awards for blazing the HDTV trail. The network was recognized as "Best DTV Network," and CBS affiliate WRAL in Raleigh, NC, was announced "Best Local DTV Broadcaster." The network also received recognition for providing the "Best DTV Sporting Event" for its HD broadcast of the 2001 Superbowl. "

It's obvious that the opening salvo in your final part was a total fabrication, and that you have no regard for determing the truth in what you write.

And your handling of Fox 6 Milwaukee... what a coward. This was an opportunity to do an expose on the sleazy "FCC compliance manuveur" at WITI. The Packer game was broadcast.... yada yada yada... give me a break. I wonder how many people on this board, admittedly a collection of HDTV-intoxicated techo-geeks, can receive this crappy signal. Didn't we have a show of hands lately???

To all of you who asked for us (me) to "take it lite" with Tim C...I am sorry, I have no use for anyone who has the ear of such a large number of readers (read potential buyers) and at worse makes things up!?


Yeah, I am patient and digital broadcasting will be here and everyone will live in OZ and have hundred thousand dollar TV sets. But is ain't gonna happen with (I can't even come up with an age appropriate adjective) journalists causing obstacles through incompetence.

I'm Done!

------------------
Patrick K. McHugh MBA MCSE
mcq@mc-hugh.com
Sony 61HS10 (4x3!!!!)
RCA DTC100
Pioneer VSX-D710S Receiver
Infinity 5.1 (passive) Speakers

Intel 1.8ghz P4 w/ 512mb Memory
Digital Stream HiDTV Pro
ATI Radeon 8500 Dual Monitor Video
Viewsonic (Analog!) 19" monitor
ADI 17" MicroScan Panel
SB Live Platinum
Cambridge Soundworks Desktop 5.1 Speakers

I must be a real techno-geek as I have two full HDTV setups, one acting as a DVR!

[This message has been edited by mcq (edited 12-11-2002).]

[Kevin Arnold]

Think about this. From the start when fiddling with your black and white set to get a good picture and endless tuning of a UHF converter box to get channel 19 cartoons on a Sat. morning to endless trips to the television to adjust the color in the early 60's as it changed with each program telecast we now have come to the point where there's money to be made selling once free products. Bottle some water and charge $1.50 for it, repackage over the air television on a cable and throw in 50+ re-run stations and a few movie services and get $50+ per month for it. Yet most people watch the network stuff anyway - they just pay big bucks to get it. If I'm Zenith or Samsung or Sony I want to get the price of the STB down as fast as I can - subsidize it or subsidize the tuner in the TV. In fact if I were a broadcaster I would figure out a way to get HDTV ready owners to buy this with rebates, incentives or whatever. This gives them a direct pipline to my product without all the middlemen.

As soon as there is something that people really want to see on in HD there will be a blip in sales. The Packers in the Superbowl would do it. (Closed circuit to Tim C. - There have been previous superbowls in HD!)

[Matt Heebner]

I too am kinda unhappy with the way he ended these articles. I don't want to nit-pick over things he wrote about, but I feel it is important that people (especially ones who might be interested in gettin into HD) get all the complete facts. The last two parts of the series didn't tell the whole story.
 
I really feel he didn't completely fill people in on what is all out there to get. He made it sound as though he could hardly find stuff to watch. Some days I have to actually decide what to watch. There is actually quite a bit on any given time during prime time.

Also he mentions that it's hard to find a HD TV under $1000....HUH??
The last two or three weeks Best Buy has had an ad for a 27" Samsung HD-Ready TV for $688!!! A 30" Samsung wide-screen, or a 32" 4:3 HD Ready Samsung set will set you back $999. Thats only slightly more than a similiar sized Sony Wega analog set!  STB (also Samsung) can be had for as little as $399.  Damn, thats about what I paid for my first DVD player in 1999. I also remember first getting satellite (about 5 1/2 years ago when systems were selling for about $499 for ONE room, two rooms almost put you into the thousand mark). It wasnt exactly as easy as cable to get it hooked up, aimed, and properly set-up (especially if you did it yourself) but the payout was excellent! It totally blew cable away back then. Well worth the extra effort. I feel the same way about High Definition.

Like I said before, I dont mind him writing about his viewpoint, but I wish he had presented all the evidence.

Matt

[gparris]

You are correct in writing that not ALL the options were covered in writing about getting HDTV. The local productions unable to get off the ground due to cost was interesting, but I was not impressed in the explanation. I wanted his inputs on all the ways to get HD in the Milwaukee area, not just cable. In addition, no clarity on what we know as a group in what is upcoming in HD: it was just glossed-over as a positive reaction, but without any real research. You do more research, tell the more story, thereby adding a few more days to your report and I'll give you a "A" for your reporting, but until then... Do you really think "Joe six-pack" is really reading your article, anyway? He's on the Sports pages. The consumer that is getting a new TV for the holidays IS reading the story, and he got HALF the story. Journal Communications did its advertisers that sell HD sets a disservice and me, the subscriber, having Tim report the way he did...thanks a lot...for (almost nothing).