Attention all PBS viewers!!!!

[GS kid]

I have been in constant contact with 10/36 public relations person Karen Copper for months now. She states the station has gotten complaints about the channel blackouts during HD programing. She's not sure what they should do. There always has to be SOMEBODY who has to try and mess it up for the majority of us who want HD programing. I've told her I will gather input as to how to try and make everybody happy if possible. Please add your comments and I will either pass them on to her or have her come here directly and read them. We are their DIGITAL viewers so let's help them out!
----- GS kid


[This message has been edited by GS kid (edited 05-23-2002).]

[GS kid]

Here are a couple of my suggestions:

1: We could have them HD record the feed and show it in a time-slot of a program that's going to have an encore showing later that week anyhow.

2: Maybe do what CBS-58 does with their 3 channels. Have 10 on 10-1, 36 on 10-2, and have the HD program on 10-3. Have PBSyou, PBSkids and the eagle channel blacked out during this time after which everything pops back in to normal. I watched Young & the Restless today (which uses true HD cameras although softened a bit by them to give it a slight artistic look) and JAG last night (which is a less then ideal film-to-HD conversion). I must say that my eyes noticed only a slight decline in quality with 3 channels on then the original 2 channel setup. Mostly in a slight increase in digital noise in background fields.

3: Keep it as is.

As for Standard-def Wide-screen edition programing, I'll say this. I talked with Mike the engineer at 10/36 about this awhile back. If I heard him correctly, he said that in order to do that, they would need to block out ONE of the main channels to do this. He said they had no plans at this time to show Standard-def wide-screen.
My suggestions:
1: Since the INITIAL showing of the SD wide-screen program is at night, maybe the low bandwidth allocation of 10-5 might be enough to be "borrowed" by this program so that it can be in wide-screen and then promptly returned afterwards. That way 10-2,10-3,and 10-4 are untouched. Who needs to see the eagle at night?!?!?
2: If taking 10-5 doesn't give it enough to show it, then I say block out PBSyou or PBSkids during the program's INITIAL broadcast.
---- GS kid

[Kevin Arnold]

Interesting. Here's my 2 cents.

Since the whole idea behind the digital revolution was the fantastic pictures possible it makes no sense to turn the digital channel into a mini cable system  pumping out the same product as before, just raising the cost of receiving it. When PBS has a HD product on, please shut down the multicast or limit it so that the program can be seen as intended.

Since channel 36 will soon have its digital signal up why not move the multicast material to that channel when available so as to free up 10 ( for the HD material. I would suggest that WHA DT channel 20 out of Madison be viewed to see what digital HD product is around and what a station can really look like.

Additionally, if using these DT channels for standard def persists, no one will buy a HD set, they'll just wait for the converter boxes to get the same old same old on their 13 inch Magnavox.

[Joseph S]

I'm with kjarnold.

What exactly is the point of not showing HD programming?? The vast majority of digital viewers care nothing about simulcast and multicast. They want the utmost in quality first and foremost.

When you can satisfy me that you can provide top notch HD content, then see what you can add in the way of multicast, ON ANOTHER BAND.

The current state of PBS stinks. I haven't seen anything in HD since the Kurosawa documentary and other than that a rare travel show once a month prior.

At this point I'm becoming more and more frustrated with the growing lack of options. The airwaves were provided for free in an effort to bring quality programming to the masses without the need for Cable or Satellite.

Instead, it seems stations like PBS and now apparently CBS 58 as well care only about taking advantage of the airwaves to piss off the viewing public and make more money off of OUR AIRWAVES.

I don't really care if you can show 10 crummy looking stations unless you can provide us with the HD content those airwaves were given to you for in the first place.

[Rafiki]

I watched part of Nova last evening and it was on 10-1 with the others blacked out.  I also agree with kjarnold.

[bimmer_immer]

Simply this: Broadcast all original HD and widescreen SD content to the exclusion of any multicasting whenever it is available.

Also, see my letter to the General Manager of MPTV in "What's wrong with MPTV".

I cannot believe that any digital TV owner complained about the multicast being switched off for an HD broadcast. I'd say chances are near 100% that these people also have access to the PBSYou and PBS Kids via cable or satellite, and at least have a VCR (and probably a TiVO) to capture their favorite programs with.

(Ironically, they switched off the multicast tonight to show a 4:3 SD broadcast in 16:9.
Sigh. )


The simple points are:
1. Time-shifted copies of their analog broadcasts are useless.
2. If they simply publish a schedule of HD broadcasts (when they switch off the multicast), everyone will at least be aware.
3. Widescreen (anamorphic) SD broadcasts are basically DVD quality. Please "make plans" to provide this material. "Nature" for example is simply gorgeous.
4. Instead of pissing-off the digital early adopters, they should be attempting to court them. We have dropped thousands of dollars on equipment. Surely we could part with a few hundred (or hopefully more) per year to help support these broadcasts. Maybe they could create a "digital founders" interest group within the Friends organization. One of the bonuses might be a published schedule of broadcasts. They should at least be making special appeals to digital TV owners during on-air Friends pledge drives.

-Brian

[wxndave]

Originally posted by Joseph S:
[What exactly is the point of not showing HD programming?? The vast majority of digital viewers care nothing about simulcast and multicast. They want the utmost in quality first and foremost.

If you noticed, Ch 10 does program in HDTV when possible.  There isn't much for HD programming for them to run.  Everyday at 4pm they air the locally produced Tracks Ahead program.  Plus usually NOVA is aired in HD when available.  Plus there are a few other programs that air but don't come to mind.  Do you want to watch the standard PBS HD loop that is on cable?  At least they are trying to provide interesting programs while HD isn't available.Plus they do only send one channel while airing HD programs.  Isn't that what everyone wants?

 As for CBS-58, you should thank them for trying new ideas and new equipment. They are aleast willing to provide a full time HD stream.  Granted they only have Y&R during the day and most of the primetime programs.  That's all the HD programs they can get there hands on.  

What you guys should really focus your attention on is getting more programs produced in HD. But you also need to help educate the general public about HDTV.

Does anyone realize what the cost of putting a HDTV station on the air is?  By the time you get a full power transmitter, antennas, feedline, crew to install, all the various encoders, muxes, SD to HD converter, close caption encoders, frame syncs and a HD switcher.  You are probably over 1 million dollars or more.  Now that doesn't include buying any new cameras, HD editing or a new master contol for local playback.  Plus you have now just added about $4000 a month in electric costs for the high power transmitter. By the way most of this equipment is still in Beta testing at the stations.

Keep in mind that none of these stations will make any money off of HDTV for at least 5 years.  Most advertisers won't spend any money on HDTV because there are so few viewers. Even if you could find advertising you could one sell it for $5 a 30 second spot during primetime.  You know PBS can't charge any money for adds so I guess they will never make any money off of HDTV.  

I liked this website when it first started.  I would check in evereyday and see what was new.  Now I find myself not wanting to check it as much due to the negative comments.

[Joseph S]

 

Keep in mind that none of these stations will make any money off of HDTV for at least 5 years.

I find it hard to believe CBS is losing much money at this point. They are now running their own feed on a car battery and leasing out sub-channels for 1)their own affiliate of white trash cheaters/court tv programming and also 2)Telemundo.

The negativity comes from being lied to. Five years is certainly long enough to get your act together. If they don't want the digital band and don't feel it is profitable, then relinquish the rights and let someone else have a shot.

Now, I'm supposed to believe that it will take 5 additional years (10 total) to figure it out??

PBS has access to a great many HD programs and they choose to air very few of them. Even fewer programs air at the scheduled times. I do not have the Cable feed and must rely on random channel changes to see if HD content is available on PBS, because they are so secretive of the actual schedule.

 

Does anyone realize what the cost of putting a HDTV station on the air is? By the time you get a full power transmitter, antennas, feedline, crew to install, all the various encoders, muxes, SD to HD converter, close caption encoders, frame syncs and a HD switcher. You are probably over 1 million dollars or more. Now that doesn't include buying any new cameras, HD editing or a new master contol for local playback. Plus you have now just added about $4000 a month in electric costs for the high power transmitter. By the way most of this equipment is still in Beta testing at the stations.

I'm guessing many of us found $4000 to put together our own setup. Based on last quarter's results, Hearst-Argyle made enough in one quarter to give each station $2 million. Yet, we have nothing at WI$N. $48,000 a year for five years is only $250,000 + $1,000,000 installation.

The other item of interest here is that the CBS Network itself is providing equipment upgrades at all of its stations for HD transmission. Now, we have three stations sharing the bandwidth that CBS only expected to be used for one.

 

What you guys should really focus your attention on is getting more programs produced in HD. But you also need to help educate the general public about HDTV.

After reading the fall schedules, I don't think programming is the issue. All of the networks including WB will be broadcasting their lead programs in HDTV this fall. Unfortunately, we won't be able to see them. So far the only people I've convinced to go to HDTV that will actually see this benefit are my parents. Of course, the live in the Boston area where most stations have been ahead of the game instead of procrastinating.

My favorite shows are already available in HD, I just can't watch them because the station in question is in violation of the law.

[John Brundage]

I vote to black out the other subchannels and broadcast as much HDTV or widescreen shows as possible.

A schedule would also be a big help.

[MesaV]

I could NOT have said it better, Joseph S!

[GS kid]

To WXNDAVE's comment:I liked this website when it first started. I would check in everyday and see what was new. Now I find myself not wanting to check it as much due to the negative comments.

I have to say this. This board has alot of good (such as tips on reception, input from CBS-58 station manager Jim Hall, etc) and bad (complaints, anger). I have to say this. It is common nature for people to complain and vent about issues. We as people in general don't feel the need to always say when things are good. Who needs to hear 25 posts on how good The Tonight Show with Jay Leno looks?!??! It's been on in HD for quite awhile. To say it looks good is just a given at this point. No need to beat that one to death, even if it's a positive comment. When people complain on issues, it helps alot! People give input as to their experience with the issue and then discuss solutions. HDTV is fairly young in it's adoption by stations and viewers. There are still bugs and issues to work out. The stations and viewers need the input from here. How can things get better if stations don't know something is wrong or what their viewers want?!? When HDTV is perfect, I guess this board will just be about telling people about the best equipment, installing tips, and the best HD programs to watch! Won't be much to talk about otherwise! For now, it's doing the public and stations a great service!------ GS kid