I figured the 1080p thread was getting a bit busy, so I'm making a seperate thread just for this. I realize there's a thread over at AVS Forum just for this, but that's bordering on 20 pages, you have to sift thru loads of posts for very little tweaks, and in my experience they made the picture look horrible.
Keep in mind the settings could be completely different for you... if you have a different DVD player, for example. The specific brightness levels etc is sometimes quite hardware-specific. Most of the other settings not related to levels tend to be pretty universal (on/off, low/hi, or drc settings for example).
I'm no expert calibrator, but I've been doing my own television calibration for years, constantly messing with the settings of my previous HDTV LCD, and I do a lot of work with video encoding, so I have a good idea of what things are supposed to look like.
Lets get into it... for now I've found these settings by using a THX calibration and testing it on many reference quality dvd's, and some lower quality dvd's, to find a good median of settings that should look nice on most discs you put in.
Also, to find the proper settings for the digital (HDMI) inputs, I used a combination of others' ISF calibrations and freezing the picture on many dark and contrasted HD images to find the proper brightness levels.
480i/480p - it seems this television does a much better job of doing a progressive scan than your dvd player can do, so I'd highly recommend leaving your dvd player in 480i (interlaced) output mode. the hdtv tends to do a much better job of rounding out rough edges & small object detail jaggies... after all, we're talking about 720x480 pixels upscaled to 1920x1080, and they put a great upscaler in this television.
[all of the following adjustments are being made in the Pro picture mode, and with Power Saving Mode set to Standard. Also, these settings seem to carry over quite uniformly from Component, to HDMI, to the Tuner]
Iris - min (this will provide the best black levels, and even in moderately bright rooms, should provide enough light output. if not, you can always turn it up, but then the deepest blacks won't look quite as deep. Depending on content I've been known to adjust the Iris and Picture setting to brighten the picture, usually for NBC or ABC programming, but the following settings should be what you start with.)
Picture - 48
Brightness - 26
Color - 28
Hue - 0 (default)
Sharpness - 28
Color Temp - Warm
Noise Reduction - Off (if on, causes pixelization, more small object jaggies)
Direct Mode - Off (if on, reverts to interlaced mode, blurs the picture... however this could be good for noisy non-progressive content)
Game Mode - Off
Advanced Video settings:
DRC Mode - CineMotion (automatic progressive scan of film/24fps material, if it's interlaced video/30fps it will automatically adjust)
DRC Palette - Custom - change so the dot is in the lower left corner, and both the Reality and Clarity settings are in the "1" positions. if you don't do this, it will add a lot of artificial sharpness and clarity, causing jaggies on certain textures
BN Smoother - Off (causes small object detail to go jaggy if on)
Advanced Iris - Off (constantly changes iris if enabled, noticeable)
[If you're having blue or green hue problems, try enabling this, it seems to get rid of most of it. This also greatly improves black levels. I prefer it on, it's up to you.]
Color Corrector - Off (causes red push/unnatural skin tones if on)
DTE - Off (causes bad edge enhancement if on)
Clear White - Off (adds blue hue to true white & causes white crush if on)
Detail Enhancer - Off (enhances artifacts if on)
Black Corrector - Off (kills shadow detail and messes with your perfect brightness settings if on)
Gamma Corrector - Off (only might be useful if connecting to a PC)
White Balance:
R-Gain: -12
G-Gain: -6
B-Gain: 0
R-Bias: 3
G-Bias: -3
B-Bias: -3
I'd recommend using DRC Mode - CineMotion and having the DRC Palette on the setting of Reality - 1 and Clarity - 1. (Totally in the left lower corner.) The default setting over-sharpens a bit and accentuates digital block noise on scene changes. Keep in mind, you will only get the DRC Mode and DRC Palette options when viewing 480i or 1080i material. 480p and 720p are already progressive, so there's no need for the television to process any of that again.
Update: Just checked the settings against INHD's tune-up program. I must say I don't completely trust it... according to that, my brightness on the HDMI input should be at 18, which just kills all sorts of detail in darker colors and blacks. It seems my DVD calibration findings carried over well, something's up with that INHD tune-up.
Something I forgot to mention... there is a delay on this screen when you're having it take care of the 480i -> 1080p conversion, and to me anyway, a noticeable lip sync problem. This was solved by selecting an 80ms video delay on my DVD player... so be sure you have a DVD player capable of doing that before getting this tv. (Although you might not have this problem if you let the DVD player output progressive, but the hdtv just does a better job of that.)
Quite informative, dude! :wave:
Okay... lately I've noticed the dreaded "blue hue" problem in very dark scenes and on letterboxing, on the lower left corner. I discovered something very interesting: if I restore the brightness to the default "31" setting, as soon as it hits that setting, the picture evens out, and then there's nothing in the lower left corner, but now there's a weaker blue hue in the bottom right corner. Then I went into the White Balance, and adjusted the B-Bias to -2. As soon as it hit -2, the other blue hue completely disappeared. Awesome. However, changing the bias to this caused the picture to be just a tiny bit too yellow. I compensated for this by also adjusting the R-Bias and G-Bias to -2. I left the other three White Balance settings alone.
Finally, I've found I prefer the picture setting on 48 (a setting found by someone else's pro calibration), also leaving the color and sharpness on the default 31... it seems when I change the brightness to 31, I have to change these other settings back to 31 to compensate.
Another update... I found the following tweaks from someone else's calibration, and it seems to solve both my blue hue problem, and the yellow tinge this television tends to add to everything. (I'm not updating my old posts so you guys can see where I'm coming from on all these settings, and if you don't have a certain problem, since all these sets are a bit different, you skip any additional settings I had to change to solve that problem.)
Color temp: Warm (important!)
White Balance:
R-Gain: -12
G-Gain: -6
B-Gain: 0
R-Bias: 2
G-Bias: -3
B-Bias: -3
I'm gonna bet this also takes care of most of the red push. I'll keep you guys updated. :)
Updated the first post with my latest findings on the "blue hue" problem, and added some additional information, and corrected the Picture setting. This will be my final blue hue solution for now... possibly someone at AVS forum will figure out the root issue. For now with this fix, my set has a barely noticeable blue hue on the opposite corner of where the original one was. It has to be an almost completely dark scene, and you almost have to stress your eyes to even see it, even in a darkened room. So, I'm happy for now. :D
Thank you Mark for your expertise and patience writing this all down for us (hopefully) future SXRD owners.
(Maybe it could be a "sticky" for awhile).
Paul: Good luck and enjoy the new SXRD - always looks great when I see it in the store as compared to other sets in HD...even analogue looks better! :)
What are you going to do with the 51" set you have -leave it that upgraded basement area, too?
Quote from: gparris(Maybe it could be a "sticky" for awhile).
There you go ... stuck !
Quote from: gparrisWhat are you going to do with the 51" set you have -leave it that upgraded basement area, too?
No 51" here... but the 42" is now in my mom's room, since she helped me pay for the SXRD. :)
I'm glad you find this helpful!! I figured my couple days of tweaking pain should go to some use! :D
I'll keep this thread updated if I find improved settings, or better fixes for the blue hue issue.
Mark: I was asking Paul S. what what he was doing with HIS 51" Sony...sorry.
Nice work, keep up the information and what the SXRD is like over time...thanks.
OH... I should pay more attention. :D
Quote from: gparrisMark: I was asking Paul S. what what he was doing with HIS 51" Sony...sorry.
Nice work, keep up the information and what the SXRD is like over time...thanks.
:rofl:
It's going upstairs. The woman wants it up there in case I'm hogging up the new one downstairs lol
Thanks, Paul S...I knew you'd keep that set.
You know, that is why more households are becoming 2-HDTV-set ones.
It keeps the peace when you both want to watch different HD programmes.
Make sure Heather gets to watch it with some surround sound, too, unless that
is what she doesn't care much for, though the lady I know wants even more power on her amps
(Sony ES-series A/V receiver). :D
Will you post any pictures like you did before with the new SXRD as time permits? :)
Added white balance corrections found by someone else's ISF* calibration on this same model set (50"). This seems to correct most of the red push (possibly all), and removes the tinge of yellow (mostly seen on skin tones) the defaults cause.
I also had to correct the brightness/color/sharpness settings to match these new white balance settings, so I've changed those in this post as well.
I'll be interested to see how these settings work out for others once they get their SXRD's.
My temporary "fix" for the blue hue problem won't work with these new settings, but it's really not annoying enough to fuss over, and these white balance settings seem to minimize that hue a bit.
*http://www.isfcalibration.com/
Quote from: Mark StrubeI'll be interested to see how these settings work out for others once they get their SXRD's.
Well, after I do mine, you're welcome to come over to take a peek. Or, if you want, we can do this together. Eliab kinda taught me to have a trained eye. I just wish I had his 5 million dollar equipment.
Quote from: gparrisThanks, Paul S...I knew you'd keep that set.
You know, that is why more households are becoming 2-HDTV-set ones.
It keeps the peace when you both want to watch different HD programmes.
Make sure Heather gets to watch it with some surround sound, too, unless that
is what she doesn't care much for, though the lady I know wants even more power on her amps
(Sony ES-series A/V receiver). :D
Will you post any pictures like you did before with the new SXRD as time permits? :)
Nope, it's gonna be SD. We can't afford another box! Oh yes, there will be pics!
I've found one use for the Black Corrector... put it on High when watching FOX6 upscale (non-HD) picture. :D
Have you tried to mess with the service menu yet for some real tweaking? I need to get a hold of a service manual for this baby.
I seriously cannot wait for some hardcore SM tweaks, but for now I'll try yours (well, on Thursday anyways).
The red push is icky.
Nah, I don't like to mess with service menus unless I've got some definite tweaks and there's a way to reset to defaults. Feel free to let us know!
At this point I can't decide whether I like Neutral or Warm color temp. better... I realize Warm is the NTSC Standard, but Neutral seems to remove the red push without affecting skin tones. Decisions, decisions.
EDIT: I guess for now I'll stick with Warm with the White Balance tweaks.
Quote from: Mark StrubeAt this point I can't decide whether I like Neutral or Warm color temp. better... I realize Warm is the NTSC Standard, but Neutral seems to remove the red push without affecting skin tones. Decisions, decisions.
EDIT: I guess for now I'll stick with Warm with the White Balance tweaks.
One of the threads at AVS tell you where to go in the SM to take care of the push. I'll do it tomarrow.
"480i/480p - it seems this television does a much better job of doing a progressive scan than your dvd player can do, so I'd highly recommend leaving your dvd player in 480i (interlaced) output mode. the hdtv tends to do a much better job of rounding out rough edges & small object detail jaggies... after all, we're talking about 720x480 pixels upscaled to 1920x1080, and they put a great upscaler in this television."
How do you know if its converting the interlaced signal to progressive?? Does it say at the top right? Does this only work if its hdmi (my 910 is componant only)?
No, this will work on any interlaced source... no matter the input. That's what CineMotion means, converting interlaced 29.97fps content to 23.976fps film content. If you change it to Mode 1 or Mode 2 which doesn't convert to film but uses a deinterlacer you'll notice a picture that isn't nearly as smooth or detailed.
If you're asking which "mode" it's in when in CineMotion, there's really no way to tell, since it's adaptive... so if you're watching something with film content it'll automatically detect that and process an inverse telecine (converting to 23.976fps)... but then if you switch to something that is fully interlaced with a video source (Curb Your Enthusiasm for example), it'll switch deinterlacing modes.
Quote from: Mark StrubeNo, this will work on any interlaced source... no matter the input. That's what CineMotion means, converting interlaced 29.97fps content to 23.976fps film content. If you change it to Mode 1 or Mode 2 which doesn't convert to film but uses a deinterlacer you'll notice a picture that isn't nearly as smooth or detailed.
If you're asking which "mode" it's in when in CineMotion, there's really no way to tell, since it's adaptive... so if you're watching something with film content it'll automatically detect that and process an inverse telecine (converting to 23.976fps)... but then if you switch to something that is fully interlaced with a video source (Curb Your Enthusiasm for example), it'll switch deinterlacing modes.
Whoa, thats a lot of information lol thanks!
I've discovered if you enable the Advanced Iris, that almost completely removes the blue hue problem (blobs in the corners) this screen tends to have. Although then you'll notice the overall brightness changing by scene or as things move in the screen... but you get used to it fast, and I think it's worth it for the increased contrast and removal of the blue hue problem.
For now I have it set on High, I haven't really gotten a chance to truly see what the difference is between the 3 settings.
This is enabled by default if you use the Standard or Vivid settings... perhaps Sony was well aware of this problem, and expected most people to use one of those settings so they wouldn't notice the issue.
Excellent info...thanks. I am moving to Milwaukee soon and will also be getting the SXRD, as I noticed the picture looked amazing in the store.
Of course, I am concerned because I keep reading about certain occurences of the 'green glob' effect. How widespread is this and should it be a real concern of mine? The salesman in Circuit City said he had never heard of it (of course, I am not counting him as a videophile or anything).
Also, all those options you tweaked in post #1...are those easy to find? Do you recommend paying someone to professionally calibrate the tv?
Quote from: Movin2MilwaukeeExcellent info...thanks. I am moving to Milwaukee soon and will also be getting the SXRD, as I noticed the picture looked amazing in the store.
Of course, I am concerned because I keep reading about certain occurences of the 'green glob' effect. How widespread is this and should it be a real concern of mine? The salesman in Circuit City said he had never heard of it (of course, I am not counting him as a videophile or anything).
Also, all those options you tweaked in post #1...are those easy to find? Do you recommend paying someone to professionally calibrate the tv?
The tech thats fixing my SXRD says its very common. See the 500+ thread on it at AVS lol
Ohh so you had a green blob problem Paul S? I'm assuming it stayed after the screen has warmed up? I have a green blob in the center of my screen, but only for the first minute or two while it's warming up, after that it's totally gone.
I don't suppose the tech is able to fix the blue hue problems? I've found using the Advanced Iris takes care of a good amount of the blue hue issues.
Gosh, I have got to look at our forum for tweeks when I get my SXRD.
(No, Paul S., I didn't get one yet....sorry to read you had a situation...wish you luck...tell Heather I am "allowed" to get one, now.) :blush:
I am waiting for money owed me to buy mine.
Looks like Mark Strube has got the details I will need if a situation develops. :D
Quote from: Mark StrubeOhh so you had a green blob problem Paul S? I'm assuming it stayed after the screen has warmed up? I have a green blob in the center of my screen, but only for the first minute or two while it's warming up, after that it's totally gone.
I don't suppose the tech is able to fix the blue hue problems? I've found using the Advanced Iris takes care of a good amount of the blue hue issues.
The blob und der hue. It drives me nuts! Were still waiting on a new light engine so they can come install it. I pray thatll work!
Quote from: gparrisGosh, I have got to look at our forum for tweeks when I get my SXRD.
(No, Paul S., I didn't get one yet....sorry to read you had a situation...wish you luck...tell Heather I am "allowed" to get one, now.) :blush:
I am waiting for money owed me to buy mine.
Looks like Mark Strube has got the details I will need if a situation develops. :D
Heather said 'yaaaaay! congratulations!" Make sure the build date is post Febuary. Those have been a lil better in regards to getting a 'bad' set.
Who are we shaking down for the $$? ;)
Per Paul S. :
"Heather said 'yaaaaay! congratulations!" Make sure the build date is post Febuary. Those have been a lil better in regards to getting a 'bad' set.
Who are we shaking down for the $$?"
One of me mates, Resident Pirate, sir...you cannot trust some of 'em and then they think they can play "pirate" with you...ugh! :mad:
Adding to that, I just came back from Circuit City-Southridge and the 50" SXRD is on sale for $3149.99 through the 18th.
Shiver me timbers!
Thanks for the ask, matey! :D
Quote from: gparrisPer Paul S. :
"Heather said 'yaaaaay! congratulations!" Make sure the build date is post Febuary. Those have been a lil better in regards to getting a 'bad' set.
Who are we shaking down for the $$?"
One of me mates, Resident Pirate, sir...you cannot trust some of 'em and then they think they can play "pirate" with you...ugh! :mad:
Adding to that, I just came back from Circuit City-Southridge and the 50" SXRD is on sale for $3149.99 through the 18th.
Shiver me timbers!
Thanks for the ask, matey! :D
Arrrgh! :p
Thanks for the cheerleading, Paul S. and Heather!
Now I'm told that I can get the 60" SXRD when the price drops again...UGH!
(and of course, the build is after the timeframe you gave it and I get my money back...arg!)
Have you got your light engine fixed yet? :wave:
Quote from: gparrisHave you got your light engine fixed yet? :wave:
Funny story- when they were getting to the light engine, the slightly retarded helper ripped a ribbon cable. That was a week ago today and my set is here in peices waiting for a new ribbon cable and a light engine install. No 360 for a week now, and no call from the shop saying the part is in/appointment schedule. I channeled my anger by ripping out a wall in the basement on St Pattys.
I'm rebuilding the wall this coming weekend.
Paul S. : Sorry for your pain. That wall of yours - glad you feel better now. :(
Does the other HDTV set - the Sony CRT RPTV - at least have an HD box attached to it - the one Heather watches so you can at least have a "backup"?
You see, I do have HDTV backups, just because of your situation - maybe its just me, but it hurts a little less if one goes out and you have bad repairmen :)
Note: It is my understanding that you bought your Sony SXRD 60" set from Best Buy-was this their "recommended & authorized" repair department doing this so-called "repairing"? :bang:
If so, remind me to put Best Buy off my "buy list" when I do purchase the set like you have...what happened is unforgiveable, no excuses - to your set, not your wall....just awful! :mad:
I've made a kind of interesting discovery. Note this is with Advanced Iris on High... I'm pretty sure that doesn't affect the outcome of this test, but just so you know.
I discovered this by running the THX test from my DVD player thru component switching the player between 480i and 480p mode... and thru the 8300HD connected thru HDMI using various dark scenes from movies from HBO-HD and HDNet Movies. My box is set to always output 1080i, so I can't confirm this for 720p. (I was able to determine the correct setting because one notch up would introduce solid areas of compression artifacts in the "blackness" of the picture, and one or more notches down didn't improve the black level, and only made detail in the picture go away.)
When my tv is receiving a 480p or 1080i signal, the correct brightness setting is 27... while when it's receiving a 480i signal, the correct brightness setting is 29. While it doesn't sound like a big deal, even one notch off can totally kill dark scenes, where you'll see all kinds of noise that wouldn't be there otherwise.
Also, INHD and INHD2 seems to have different black levels from all the other HD channels. When I'm testing using dark scenes from their In Theaters program, it's as if my brightness is almost 10 notches too high... turning it all the way down to 20 fixes it, but then ALL the other channels look far too dark. When I was tweaking using INHD's tune-up program, the correct brightness setting is 16... which is obviously wrong.
When I did my setup on my SXRD, I used Pro mode only, but kept most of the settings much the same except for the sharpness and white balance.
This is for the cable box primarily, not the DVD player.
Using the avsforums' forum members' suggested settings for the Denon DVD upconversion players are right on track, too. :D
Component cabling is working fine for now with the 8300HD DVR, though the HDMI worked good until the recent programming change with TWC. :rolleyes:
So just thought I would share this...Bought this set back in November, and last month it developed a green corner (lower right) and when it was on a fairly light screen (grey), the sides or what would be a 4:3 was a lighter shade of green. Almost looked like burn-in which I thought was impossible with LCD technology. Well after calling CC because I did not have their extended warranty, I had to go direct to Sony. After looking at forums it seemed this more than common issue, but in most cases it goes away after 20 minutes, not mine. After going to an IL certified sony repair place, it was determined that it needed an optical block replacement. Which is what the forums said.
The service at Sony is unbelievable...You would think that a purchase of something this expensive that you would get better service. They have had me set for 3 weeks! Finally I talked with a regional manager for Circuit City, he agreed to replace the set with a new one. We will see as he has not given me a date yet.
Well for what is worth, I thought I should post this. I do believe this has one of the best pictures out there but am very concerned with the durability of this TV. Is this going to happen 2 years from now? Because it is very hard to watch when you are as critcal about the picture as I am. Anyone else have this problem?
Thanks for the information. The A2000 models are coming in, so the XBR1 is in very short supply.
The CC in Racine I go to, the manager said they only had one of each to sell and that was it. :(
As for the lack of an extended warranty combined with a change in model year is is a problem, I didn't realize the Sony's warranty sucked that bad. :mad:
The closest replacement SXRD set has fewer features than the older model (XBR1) and it had some issues...see cnet article link in our forum.
The XBR2s are coming later this year, your best choice for replacement and will probably be out before your one year warranty runs out in November.
No one has checked this model out, though the A2000s have not had any green blob issues to date from reports that I have read (a good sign).
Good luck and I await to see if my optical block goes out by the end of the year, if that is "Sony Quality" for SXRD panels, but I DO have the CC extended warranty at the very least.
Honestly, I cannot believe Sony does not keep those optical blocks or "light engines" (as they call them) for immediate replacement since there have been problems this past year...bad on their part, really bad.
Additionally, I hope the replacement set, if it comes to that, comes with a new matching stand like I purchased with my SXRD XBR1. :blush:
After 2 fixes, I was given a new one that was 'acceptable'.
I just wanted to follow up, after my disaster with Sony and their support. Circuit City replaced my 60SXRD XBR1 with a new one! Thank you CC. I certainly would think twice about Sony products in the future after this, not because of quality (that happens) but more because they basically didn't do anything. I was promised so many calls back and only one time did I get a call. After I requested the TV not be repiared and replaced with new instead, they didn't call back. Well I sure hope that this TV does not develop any problems. Knock on wood. :)
Has anyone noticed a difference in the upconvert on the 8300 cable box and the job this TV does with SD channels?
I think the picture is better on SD cahnnel setting the cable box to 1080i output only and letting the TV upconvert that.
Anyone else try?
Also seems the HDMI on the 8300 will work with my denon reciever now. It wouldn't about a year ago when I first tried it