Picked the brain of a TWC tech. the other day

[Jack 1000]

Wasn't Crapigator rolled out in several other markets before it hit WI?  Doesn't make sense. :huh?:

Hey, I hope TWC gets their act together this year and does roll out 100 national HD channels.  It might force D* to back to their freewheeling deal days before they began their HD rollout last fall.  Plus, I'd really like to have the advertised 15 MB down pipe to the house.  When I tried RR last fall the best I could ever get was 1.5 MB down, far from the advertised speed.

Good points Steve,

The 640000 Question than becomes, can Crapigator handle 100 channel additions, IF and WHEN TWC does roll them out?  They would be best to get the SDV working and fully functional first before they start adding more channels.  As much as HD Subs want more channels in HD, doesn't it become a moot point if there are still problems with the guide?

Jack

[vegasvic]

Many of their reps are still telling callers that they need digital cable by next February.  

This rep may have been truthful.  But he'd be in the 1% minority of TWC employees.

[kevbeck122]

"By Feb. 2009, an all digital network will allow for 100+ HD channels in the Milwaukee area. "

This implies, to me at least, that the company intends to pull the plug on analog cable sooner rather than later, which will have significant implications for multi-display homes.

A friend of mine has RCN down in Chicago, which has converted to all digital (or very soon will be).  I don't think there's an extra monthly charge for the box he has - it's really small and has no display on the front of it.  I would assume TWC would invest in similar cheap boxes and rent them out for little or nothing if they're going to go all digital in the near future.  Then again, it's TWC.. they'll charge you for anything.

[goldenear]

^^^good info...thanks for sharing.  Of course, your final statement is in play as well.  And that's why I've moved entirely to a whole home A/V distribution network over component & HDMI with all equipment centrally rack mounted and switched via a matrix switch.  That breaks the additional equipment charge model with even the DBS providers (now limited to a chosen number of concurrently viewed displays, not strictly number or displays).

[Blitzburgh]

Cable??? LOL

I feel sorry for the Lemmings that dont know any better.

Actually the people I feel sorry for are the ones who know DirecTV is the king but can't make the change for various reasons.

[mhz40]

Cable??? LOL

I feel sorry for the Lemmings that don't know any better.

Nice... Knock down 70% of pay TV consumers & people in this group cuz they don't agree with you by likening them to a small rodent.

:OnAir: / On:
The fact is, many millions of consumers are happy with cable, as millions more are equally happy with satellite, U-verse & FiOS.  This fact is undeniable, as they all pull out their wallet each month to pay the bill.
If the benchmark of 'best' is driven only by the number of HD channels, your assertion would be right on the money---today.  The landscape of HD will change.  It's not happening as fast as everyone here would like, but it will change.  Unfortunately for us, there is more to overall customer satisfaction for the masses than HD content, like reliability, price, contractual obligations, initial cost and the  availability of analog channels after 2/09.  Also, tier two services like video on demand, and packages including HSD & phone also all factor in to the consumers decision.  Although reasons differ, obviously there are compelling reasons for millions to stay with cable, or the reality would be different.
Considering TV used to be free and networks actually had a 26 week season every fall & winter; maybe all of us paying for TV are the true Lemmings.
:OnAir: /Off

[Jack 1000]

I agree with Mhz,

People would be surprised at the number of subscribers who are perfectly happy with analog service and actually watch channels like HSN.  I believe that it may larger than we assume.

There's also no "All good" or "All Bad" with Cable, Dish, or U-Verse.  There are +'s and -'s with all services competing against a struggling economy.  Deals are wonderful sales pitches, regardless of what you take, but the questions such as how long do they last? What are subs getting from one service that they aren't getting from another service?

Dish has its downsides with long term service contracts.  TWC Cable has its downsides with the unpredictable behavior of its Navigator Guide.  And U-Verse is not mainstream enough to begin a full-scale evaluation at this time, but still runs off of existing phone lines.

If any of these competing businesses were all bad and that message was sent across public lines, these companies would hardly have any customers.  I don't see that happening.  Remember that forums such as this, represent an extremely knowledgeable user-support population.  However, that population is such a microcosm of the macrocosm that these big conglomerates whether they be TWC, Charter, Dish Network, U-Verse or Direct TV, aren't going to notice one way, or the other.

Jack

[Tom Snyder]

Maybe "lemmings" is bit harsh, but I think a lot of people have a fear of the unknown.

I was a cable subscriber for nearly twenty years, and was aware of Satellite but never even considered it...it was just too unfamiliar.  Just about every house and apartment already has cable, and all ya gotta do is plug in. Satellite is just too scary for most people. I only switched because, in 1999, Satellite offered HD and Cable didn't.

People only change when the pain of staying the same is greater than the pain of changing. And for most people, how they get their TV signals causes no pain at all...it's just not a big deal until their cable provider does something to tick them off. Only then will they even entertain an alternative.

Those of us who are passionate and opinionated are a vocal minority.

[vegasvic]

Agreed with the fear factor.  Cable is the easy choice so that's what most people have.  Since they've never had anything else they don't know what they're missing. With education (forums such as these) along with cables horrible customer service it's slowly changing.  

There are many people who are well educated about all of the options, still chose cable, and are happy with it.  That's great.   There is nothing about cable that I've missed since switching a few years ago.

[ArgMeMatey]

3. By Feb. 2009, an all digital network will allow for 100+ HD channels in the Milwaukee area.  

4. Next big step is to offer channel by channel subscriptions to TWC customers.  You pay for only the channels you want.

I am sure you saw this bill stuffer that came with my TW e-bill notification, bold emphasis added by me:

IMPORTANT INFORMATION ON THE DTV TRANSITION:
 
On February 17, 2009, full-power TV stations will stop broadcasting in analog and switch to 100% digital broadcasting. For more information, contact Time Warner Cable at 1.800.TWCABLE or visit http://www.dtv.gov. As a Time Warner Cable customer, your TVs connected to cable will continue to display [the same/full-power/broadcast] stations. However, analog-only TVs that receive those stations via an antenna won't display them after 2/17/09 unless you take action. (Those TVs should continue to display low-power, Class-A and translator TV stations and work with gaming consoles, VCRs, DVD players, etc.) One option: Contact Time Warner Cable at 1.800.TWCABLE to have those TVs connected to cable. (Installation fees may apply.) Other options: replace those TVs or buy converter boxes that will allow them to display DTV signals. The NTIA will provide up to two $40 coupons per household for the purchase of such boxes. For information, visit https://www.dtv2009.gov or call 888-DTV-2009.


Choose your theory:
1.  The tech is uninformed and feeding you a line.
2.  The tech has been fed by someone uninformed.
3.  TW has a secret plan to give customers a false sense of security and then pull the rug out.  
4.  Bev Greenberg fed one line to plant maintenance and a polar opposite line to customer service and Tim Cuprisin.  

I have the $16 a month plan where the cable goes through my Electroline amp and straight into the backs of all of my four TVs, DVD recorder and VCR.  Not though six set-top boxes.  If analog goes away and isn't replaced by clear QAM, it's sayonara Time Warner.  I am sure they will not miss me!

If on the other hand they can offer a la carte, we'll do the math and see if we can send a little more money their way.  Probably not $50 or $60 a month, but if we can keep it to $1 or $1.25 a day, I could live with that.

[tencom]

Most cable/satellite providers contracts with program providers will not allow for program channels to be carried on a ala-carte basis. Especially the channels that are controlled by ABC. CBS, FOX, and NBC, who see Cable/satellite subscribers as a gold mine. Only an act of conqress could permit Cable/satellite providers the option of offering ala-carte pricing.  And even if ala-carte is offered as an option what makes you think that you would be paying less  for cable/satellite service when most likely the program providers will just raise there prices to the cable/ satellite operators, that will be passed on to the consumer to makeup for less revenue for lost subscribers? Contributors to this forum should become more   aware and study the issues before commenting on them.

[goldenear]

Choose your theory:
1.  The tech is uninformed and feeding you a line.
2.  The tech has been fed by someone uninformed.
3.  TW has a secret plan to give customers a false sense of security and then pull the rug out.  
4.  Bev Greenberg fed one line to plant maintenance and a polar opposite line to customer service and Tim Cuprisin.

You can't relate digital cable to OTA digital broadcast with the above scenarios because neither one has anything to do with the other at the consumer end.  Digital cable boxes will happily output an analog stream over component, S-vid, composite, and coax, thus maintaining full compatibility with existing analog televisions.  This is why the TWC blurb correctly identified TWC as a viable alternative to either replacing your analog set or purchasing an OTA converter box.

So TWC could still pull the plug on its analog offering (forcing all subs to move to digital cable) and still remain the alternative option to analog OTA folks.

[ArgMeMatey]

You can't relate digital cable to OTA digital broadcast with the above scenarios because neither one has anything to do with the other at the consumer end.  Digital cable boxes will happily output an analog stream over component, S-vid, composite, and coax, thus maintaining full compatibility with existing analog televisions.  This is why the TWC blurb correctly identified TWC as a viable alternative to either replacing your analog set or purchasing an OTA converter box.

So TWC could still pull the plug on its analog offering (forcing all subs to move to digital cable) and still remain the alternative option to analog OTA folks.

My semantic angle goes like this:

Since it does not specify otherwise, the TW blurb implies that existing analog subscribers will see no changes in the near future.  We all know analog will disappear eventually, but I stand by my earlier analysis.  

TW says "... analog-only TVs that receive those stations via an antenna won't display them after 2/17/09 unless you take action."

It does not say "analog-only TVs that receive these stations via cable ..."

So how could this be read to imply what you are saying?  Only if Time Warner is going to give me an infinite number of set-top boxes for no extra charge.

The only thing I could get by reading between the lines is "Cable good, OTA bad.  OTA not care you have to spend big money for picture box.  Cable like you.  Cable take care of you even if OTA abandon you."

[goldenear]

Since it does not specify otherwise, the TW blurb implies that existing analog subscribers will see no changes in the near future.

That's not what I read.  The insert mentions individuals possessing analog displays, not analog cable subscribers.

The only thing I could get by reading between the lines is "Cable good, OTA bad.  OTA not care you have to spend big money for picture box.  Cable like you.  Cable take care of you even if OTA abandon you."

Exactly correct!  My point is that it doesn't matter how the cable is delivered - either via digital or analog - it still will be compatible with an analog television because the digital decoders can output an analog signal.  So there is no contradiction between the TWC insert and what the TWC tech said regarding the discontinuance of analog cable in '09.

[opfreak]

when you become a regular customer like me.

your final bill for hd cable with 2 dvrs, HBO, and the middle of the road, roadrunner.

turns into 140 dollars a month.