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Apple TV + OTA Tuner = Cable/Sat Killer?

Started by Mark Strube, Sunday Jan 27, 2008, 05:17:23 PM

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Mark Strube

After writing this article for my website, it really got me thinking... if the Apple TV was able to get you local programming using a tuner, would it make cable or satellite obsolete to you? If the new update adds HD television shows (along with the HD movies it'll add), I really think it's one step away from really being the all-purpose home entertainment gadget. If there is a hack developed that allows me to record from this tuner, it's all over for me.

What do you guys think?

Tom Snyder

How do you get Dog Whisperer on NGC HD, Criss Angel Mindfreak on A&E HD, Frank Caliendo on TBS HD, and all the other shows on the premium channels?
Tom Snyder
Administrator and Webmaster for milwaukeehdtv.org
tsnyder@milwaukeehdtv.org

Mark Strube

Shows like that are increasingly available from the iTunes Store. (Frank TV and Mindfreak are both currently available.) At the moment they're not in HD, but I believe with the update that's coming in a few days which will make the Apple TV self-sufficient (no computer needed) and add HD movies, they may also start adding HD tv shows. I think this could be very attractive to people who generally watch very specific shows and are sick of the huge bill every month... an "a la carte" method if you will.

Bebop

A Mac mini might be a better choice than Apple TV for your needs.

Is Apple TV's CPU capable of playing 1080i OTA signal? My dual 1.8 G5 barely keeps up. I can't wait till my quad core Mac Pro to arrive.

I did briefly considered Apple TV when the rentals was announced. I wouldn't minded  720P since I don't have a 1080p set. But, it's still cheaper to get HD rentals from Netflix than from Apple.

Panasonic TH-50PX60U
Panasonic TH-42PZ85U
HDHomeRun

kevbeck122

It's got a 1 GHz Pentium M.. not much power.  The max it can handle according to Apple's specs is H.264 video.. 1280x720 @ 24fps.  People have tried getting it to work as an HD DVR and get choppy results: http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=291272.

Drummerboy

#5
Actually I'm able to get OTA HD recorded programming on my AppleTV easily.  I use an EyeTV 250 HD OTA tuner to record shows to my MacBook Pro.  After the show is recorded the EyeTV software transcodes the file to H.264 960x540 (half width and height of 1080p and Dolby 5.1 downmixed to matrixed 2 channel) and syncs it to the AppleTV automatically.  The downside is the lack of live view buffering and that the shows usually takes a couple hours to transcode.  Also I'll admit the solution isn't "Kitchen ready", but then again neither are most cable box DVR's.  And although its not as "pure" as the original recording, its still hella better than analog devices or paying $60+ dollars a month.
There has been no confirmation that any product other than AppleTV will have HD downloads.  Therefore likely there will not be HD downloads to the Mac Mini or any other any time soon.
And since there will be HD rentals for the AppleTV available I have less of a reason to get a blu-ray player.
And yes I ditched subscription television services two years ago.
Drummerboy, Computer & Network Engineer
Waukesha

Bebop

#6
Soon a Blu-ray player might be cheaper than Apple TV. :)

Basically, the Mac mini is for OTA and QAM. So, one doesn't have to spend hours transcoding for iTune.

I don't know if the Elgato Turbo h.264 can support 960*540, but it'll probably speed up your transcoding.

Panasonic TH-50PX60U
Panasonic TH-42PZ85U
HDHomeRun

Mark Strube

The fact that the Apple TV can handle h.264 at 720p without a problem, tells me that 1080p mpeg2 wouldn't be an issue... if it supports that codec. No idea about 1080p h.264 however... but keep in mind I'm also considering the possibility of them releasing new revisions of the hardware that could handle things like that, this hardware hasn't been updated since it was released back in March '07.

Bebop

It's the nVidia G72M chip (same as the 7400) in the Apple TV that does most of the work.  It supports H.264 and Mepg-2. It does not say up to what resolutions.

http://www.nvidia.com/page/go_7300.html

I don't have an Apple TV, but there are 1080p trailers on iTune store. When the new software arrives, maybe someone can test it out.

Panasonic TH-50PX60U
Panasonic TH-42PZ85U
HDHomeRun

tywest

Well i just picked up my apple tv yesterday and its pretty sweet.

So far i have about 25 of my dvd's stored on my Time Capsule. I am using the atv in streaming mode. The dvd's look good. I am using handbreak to rip them in the atv setting.

I think the coolest thing so far are the podcasts. Especially the video podcasts. They have HD podcast that look pretty dag good for being streamed online.

The only problem i am having is the music and slideshow bug that seems to be out there. I have been looking at other threads that discuss the problem of no music or playlist being available under the "Settings" part of the slideshow list. So, currently i can not play music with my photos. If anyone knows a solution to this please let me know. I have been searching but have yet to find a reason. Like i said i am streaming my media and not syncing it.

I am still checking this thing out and there is a lot more to it than i first thought.

Bebop

I hope the Apple TV DVR rumors are true for June.

How are the HD rentals?

Panasonic TH-50PX60U
Panasonic TH-42PZ85U
HDHomeRun

basshive

Just watched our first HD rental via AppleTV and I am very very pleased. I see many more rentals in my future. (Rental = The Brave One)

Once I chose to purchase, it was ready for viewing in under 5 mins. We waited though and watched it a few days later. Since we do not have a standard HD DVD player or BlueRay I cannot comment on the quality compared and I am sure it is not as great but I was plenty pleased. I do use a samsung upconvert and it was far superior to that.

Using HDMI, 720P to the Sony 60inch rptv it was an awesome experience. I have to hook the optical audio up now that 5.1 is supported.  I think we will give it another try with I Am Legend.
Sony KDF-60XS955 - Living Room
Samsung LN32A450 - Master Bedroom
Samsung BDP-1600
Samsung DVD-HD850
DirecTV HR-21
DirecTV H-20
DirecTV R-22
DirecTV R-15
DirecTV Packers Remote RC64RB
Sling Media Slingbox AV - SB240-100
Yamaha YSP-900BL Digital Sound Projector Home Theater Speaker System
AppleTV
Microsoft XBOX 360
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basshive

Drummerboy is dead on here. We use the eyetv hybrid from Elgato and it is simply awesome. Clear QAM, OTA and Analog cable. EyeTV will automatically convert your shows and drop them on your AppleTV. I find myself inching closer and closer to wondering if I need a traditional provider. The issue I see now is when companies leave iTunes like NBC did and move to Hulu. Then if I have a problem of programming being limited to what I can get OTA/Cable and if they are not on iTunes I am hosed... So close though.


As a side note, I cannot tell you the wear and tear our DVD player is being saved from now. Kids movies ripped to AppleTV so we are no longer loading them in the dvd player all the time!
Sony KDF-60XS955 - Living Room
Samsung LN32A450 - Master Bedroom
Samsung BDP-1600
Samsung DVD-HD850
DirecTV HR-21
DirecTV H-20
DirecTV R-22
DirecTV R-15
DirecTV Packers Remote RC64RB
Sling Media Slingbox AV - SB240-100
Yamaha YSP-900BL Digital Sound Projector Home Theater Speaker System
AppleTV
Microsoft XBOX 360
Harmony Advanced Universal Remote for Xbox 360

Drummerboy

Reports of my death have been greatly exaggerated.  I just thought there was plenty of coverage of the AppleTV by all of the news outlets that I didn't need to add to it.
I've had my AppleTV since last June and upgraded the software in Feb and I've loved it the whole time.   As far as rentals I've rented 3 HD titles: Resident Evil: Extinction, Live Free or Die Hard and No Reservations.  I have the 3 meg tier of DSL Internet Service from AT&T and it takes about 1 1/2 hours before I can start watching an HD title. :huh?:   I'd say the picture quality is comparable to typical OTA HD broadcasts.  It may not be as good as Blu-Ray but I still think it looks damn good compared to my progressive scan DVD player.  Standard Def movies can start after about a couple minutes.  I would say it looks better than most standard def digital OTA programming I've seen.
As far as ripping movies I've ripped about 88 movies but all before the DD5.1 support.  Gotta rerip. :(   PS: Lostify is a great Mac tool for adding tags like MPAA ratings to movies among other tags that iTunes don't allow editing.  Not sure if AppleTV's parental controls can block based on those though.
As far as Hulu I think NBC will eventually come back to iTunes.  People want to be able to watch content on their terms not the network's.  iTunes is the only solution that legally comes close to giving people most of the terms they want, content when and where they want (given they have an iPod of AppleTV).
And I don't know what issue people are having with the slideshows.  If I go under Photos - Settings I can choose a playlist and it plays when I start the slideshow.  These were settings I had tweaked in the earlier release so may be that has something to do with that.
A bug I've noticed is in regards to sorting.  In iTunes there is a tag called Sort Name that the old AppleTV used to use for sorting.  Now it uses on the movie name which sucks because where it used to list the Indiana Jones Trilogy together (I set sort names to Indiana Jones 1, 2 and 3) and they are now all over the place and out of order.
/disertation>
Drummerboy, Computer & Network Engineer
Waukesha

basshive

I hope when I said dead on people know I meant *correct* *right* hit the nail on the head, etc :)

Regarding the length of time it takes before a movie can be watched. I have seen numerous reports. Some says a few mins, some say an hour, etc. We have the 15mbit Turbo from RR. I do know for sure though it was about 5 mins or so before we had the option to start watching an HD movie. We have not rented any standard def movies, do not plan on doing so.

I feel your pain about re-ripping for 5.1 sound. I will skip re-ripping the kids movies, as they do not mind the 2.0 stereo sound :)
Sony KDF-60XS955 - Living Room
Samsung LN32A450 - Master Bedroom
Samsung BDP-1600
Samsung DVD-HD850
DirecTV HR-21
DirecTV H-20
DirecTV R-22
DirecTV R-15
DirecTV Packers Remote RC64RB
Sling Media Slingbox AV - SB240-100
Yamaha YSP-900BL Digital Sound Projector Home Theater Speaker System
AppleTV
Microsoft XBOX 360
Harmony Advanced Universal Remote for Xbox 360