1080p VS 720p

[CrashCamomilli]

I was curious how many members have used both and what their thought were on the two.

I'm getting my unit replaced under my replacement plan I purchased, and am looking at all the new 1080p's coming out.  I'd have to toss in $500-$800 to upgrade, but is it worth the money?  Especially when considering the quality of the HD channels avaliable here in Milwaukee.  I can see a future use (3-5 years away), but in 5 years I'll most likely be buying a new TV anyway.

Just looking for opinions on this issue, its my understanding that the HD-DVD players will support 1080p by HDMI, but it will most likely be 5 years before that gets popular enough to worth while also.

[Gregg Lengling]

I manage a store that sells TV's so I get to see A LOT OF TV.  There is a vast quality difference in the 1080p's when viewing HD content, remember that this actually doubles the number of pixels on the screen and gives you a smoother picture than the 720p sets.  They are similar to, but better than the 1080i CRT sets.  Both have the same number of pixels (just over 2 million) but the DILA and DLP pictures are much brighter and have wider viewing angles.

Just remember that on analog signals the better the quality of the display the worse the picture looks, so if you use a 1080P on analog cable signals it's going to look pretty bad, however it does a great job on 480i, 480P, 720P and 1080i signals.  If you get one  also consider an upconvert DVD player for the interim, there is a great difference in the picture quality between 480P out of a DVD to that of an upconversion to either 720P or 1080i.

Good luck (btw if I were up to replacing my 65" Hitachi CRT RPTV right now I'd probably buy the Toshiba 72" Cinema Series 1080P DLP, the picture seems to have better detail than the JVC 1080P DILA, the JVC picture is just too soft and muted and smoothed out).

[smack]

Greg you can correct me if I am wrong because I have been looking at some 1080p sets myself for the upcoming Playstation 3 (hopefully in 11/06).

But what I have found regarding most if not all 1080p sets is they do scale the resolution up to 1080p however they can not accept a true 1080p signal like one that would come from a HD-DVD or Blu-Ray or PS3 blu ray player.  Something along the lines that the HDMI ports on the 1080p TVs that are out now can not handle the bandwidth of the 1080p signal.  The TVs that can handle a 1080p input will be coming out in the near future.

At least this is what I gathered from the forums over at AVS.  Feel free to comment or correct this if you know differently.

Thanks

[Gregg Lengling]

Greg you can correct me if I am wrong because I have been looking at some 1080p sets myself for the upcoming Playstation 3 (hopefully in 11/06).

But what I have found regarding most if not all 1080p sets is they do scale the resolution up to 1080p however they can not accept a true 1080p signal like one that would come from a HD-DVD or Blu-Ray or PS3 blu ray player.  Something along the lines that the HDMI ports on the 1080p TVs that are out now can not handle the bandwidth of the 1080p signal.  The TVs that can handle a 1080p input will be coming out in the near future.

At least this is what I gathered from the forums over at AVS.  Feel free to comment or correct this if you know differently.

Thanks

You are correct they cannot handle 1080P via HDMI it isn't set up for that.  However some of the sets have FireWire and/or Network Capability (RJ45 Cat5 Jacks).  Both the JVC and the Toshiba have these options.  JVC actually has a PRO 1080P player which we have on display with the 61" Genessea 1080P product,  HOWEVER, the player is not the stores (it's JVC's) and it's not for sale.  But it does produce an excellent picture.

[CrashCamomilli]

Well, what their telling me, is that if I wait a few months, the new sets will have true 1080p inputs.  Apparantly the new wave of sets is supposed to hit between April and june.   Anyone know the time frame for the release of these new models?

I have a standby TV I can use for a few months if I need to, its no big deal to me, I just can't tell the difference between the two with my naked eye.  But, that may be the quality of the source matieral they are using also.


hummmm :bang:

[SamC]

You say that HDMI can not handle 1080P.  I am on the verge of purchasing the HP Pavilion MD6580n.  You are telling us that HDMI through this set will not accept 1080p.  I am completely confused.  The specs on the TV say that it accepts 1080p through HDMI which contradicts what you state in your blog.  I am literally a week away from picking up this set as it has one of the most stunning pictures I've seen.

[TPK]

I was curious how many members have used both and what their thought were on the two.

I'm getting my unit replaced under my replacement plan I purchased, and am looking at all the new 1080p's coming out.  I'd have to toss in $500-$800 to upgrade, but is it worth the money?  Especially when considering the quality of the HD channels avaliable here in Milwaukee.  I can see a future use (3-5 years away), but in 5 years I'll most likely be buying a new TV anyway.

Just looking for opinions on this issue, its my understanding that the HD-DVD players will support 1080p by HDMI, but it will most likely be 5 years before that gets popular enough to worth while also.

My personal opinion is that it depends on the size of the display..

I personally think that 1080 resolution on a (16x9) 50" or less screen (at normal viewing distances) is overkill....  Once you go above 60" (at normal viewing distances), then I would think you would start seeing the difference...

I say at normal viewing distances, because if you are going to fill up your field of view by putting your nose on the screen, then I would imagine that you would more readily notice the resolution differences...

Its sort of like digital photography...  If all you are doing is going to print out 4x6 photos, then 3 megapixes is plenty good enough..   If your going to print out 8x11 photos then you should probably have 5 megapixels...

[Mark Strube]

Once you have both 720p and 1080p sets in your house, your opinion will change.

[digdugm]

You say that HDMI can not handle 1080P. I am on the verge of purchasing the HP Pavilion MD6580n. You are telling us that HDMI through this set will not accept 1080p. I am completely confused. The specs on the TV say that it accepts 1080p through HDMI which contradicts what you state in your blog. I am literally a week away from picking up this set as it has one of the most stunning pictures I've seen.

That set looks that it will. HDMI is not what limits the other 1080p sets that are available now, it would have been two expensive to put that technology in the first generation (i.e. get it out quick at the lowest price possible, who cares how many we screw). But now theres alot of people out there that don't know that there not capable of inputing 1080p.

[Mark Strube]

At this point you can't even buy anything that will output 1080p. Also, with a properly encoded 1080i movie, since the hdtv processes an inverse telecine (effectively converting it to true 1080p), you're not going to see a difference between that and something encoded at 1080p in the first place.

[digdugm]

At this point you can't even buy anything that will output 1080p. Also, with a properly encoded 1080i movie, since the hdtv processes an inverse telecine (effectively converting it to true 1080p), you're not going to see a difference between that and something encoded at 1080p in the first place.

But most people don't buy a television (not to mention an expensive tv for "At This Point"), they want something that will be compatible with future technology. And I could imagine that a few ignorant or unscuppulos saleman told some customer that it would be. I do believe that some pc video cards can output 1080p.

But I might just still be bitter about the no analog support for blu-ray. Then again I did expect that too happen. bas****s.

[Mark Strube]

But most people don't buy a television (not to mention an expensive tv for "At This Point"), they want something that will be compatible with future technology.

And it will be. Can you not watch 1080i content on a 720p display? Of course you can.

If you connect a Blu-Ray player that outputs 1080p (which I don't believe they will) to a set that only accepts 1080i but outputs a 1080p picture... it's going to take a 1080i signal from the Blu-Ray player and be able to convert it to true progressive 1080p. That's not upconversion, that's actually determining the interlaced field order and extracting the progressive frames. Since this process I'm talking about won't involve any extra compression, just signal conversion... you're not going to see a difference. It will be true 1080p even though the signal must be 1080i.

Just calm down, and learn more about how these formats work before getting yourself so upset.

[smack]

I believe it is confirmed that the PS3 with the Blu-Ray will output at 1080p when it comes out in Nov 06.  I think most if not all sneak peaks at Blu-Ray players say they will do 1080p.  The question is whether the movies houses will put the movies in 1080p like Sony plans to do with it's games.

The problem is and am pretty sure that the HDMI input could not handle the bandwidth of the 1080p signal from the source, so you wouldn't even be able to feed a 1080p signal to a current 1080p set for the TV to cross convert from 1080p to 1080i to 1080p on the display.   I believe if you would want to feed one of these tvs a signal you would have to change the output of your player to 720p, 1080i? or 480p because it can not accept a 1080p signal unless it is via firewire/network like Greg said in an earlier post.

[Mark Strube]

I believe if you would want to feed one of these tvs a signal you would have to change the output of your player to 720p, 1080i?

That's why I said...

...it's going to take a 1080i signal from the Blu-Ray player and be able to convert it to true progressive 1080p.

In the same way a progressive scan DVD player can take a film-based movie and convert it to true 480p... except in this case, there's no extra compression artifacts from encoding it in an interlaced format in the first place, we're starting with a progressive format.

[Bebop]

You say that HDMI can not handle 1080P.  I am on the verge of purchasing the HP Pavilion MD6580n.  You are telling us that HDMI through this set will not accept 1080p.  I am completely confused.  The specs on the TV say that it accepts 1080p through HDMI which contradicts what you state in your blog.  I am literally a week away from picking up this set as it has one of the most stunning pictures I've seen.

Some can, one of them is the HP.