CBS and Signal Problems

[Stanley Kritzik]

I noticed on Channel 1-1 during and after the (sob) Packer game some pixelization and some audio break up.  After the game, I checked the meter on my D* HD10-250 for the OTA channel 46, and it was bouncing all over the place.  The other channels were steady as can be, so I think my equipment is OK.

I wonder if anyone else had a similar experience or not.

Stanley Kritzik

[smack]

I am in Waukesha and could not even pick up the signal for it.  I usually get it at about 70% but on Sunday it was bouncing between 0 - 30% so I got to watch it in SD.

I don't know if the cold weather played a part or not???

My roof was clear of ice and snow (attic mounted)

So I'll wait till it warms up this week and see if it makes a difference.

smack

[mrmike]

I've had this happen a few times in the last week on 1-1.  I've chalked it up to my antenna getting tweaked in the wind a week or so back, but if other folks are seeing it too I have to wonder.  When it's solid it's solid (Signal bar doesn't move, picutre is perfect), but sometimes I get bouncy-bouncy and tons of breakups/dropouts.

[StarvingForHDTV]

My picture was solid here.  The Packers weren't too solid though....

[smack]

Signal was solid again on Monday at about 50%.  Still a little lower than normal but there were not any viewing problems.

Strange.....

smack

[Greg Oman]

Let's bounce this one back to the top :mad:

After the Packers game which was nicely done (again) I switched  over to CBS for the 2nd game.  Well, the Jets were still making a game of it (in SD) and I started getting the audio drops and pixelization.  Hmmmm... Let me look... Oh, I have 1.1, 1.2, 1.3,1.4, 1.5, AND 1.6.  .2-.6 showing the same episode of the X-Flies.

Now, as much as my significant other likes the X-Files, it was refreshing to hear her say how "spoiled" she got watching the Bears game (she's a Bears fan, which is OK in this context) in HD only to see the Rams/Jets game in SD and with so many audio drops!.

Why do I need NCAA1 and NCAA2 and the expense of a reasonable network feed? :bang:

Here's the Irony of the situation:  Fox claimed that America wanted more channels (part of their logic for initially selecting 480p as their digital "standard") over the better quality of a 720p or 1080i signal.  They realized the error in this thinking (most of you probably have local HD via satelite or cable, not OTA) and recently began broadcasting in 720p.  And what has our local CBS affiliate done?  Hmmmm... the exact opposite, almost.

Yeah, the Bronco/Colt game has just as many audio/video drops for me.  How about you?

Greg O.


Note: The comments expressed in this reply are expressly of one individual, who has spent significant effort and time promoting and assisting the local HD community with OTA reception questions and issues.

[ReadOnly]

Originally posted by Greg Oman
Let's bounce this one back to the top :mad:

After the Packers game which was nicely done (again) I switched  over to CBS for the 2nd game.  Well, the Jets were still making a game of it (in SD) and I started getting the audio drops and pixelization.  Hmmmm... Let me look... Oh, I have 1.1, 1.2, 1.3,1.4, 1.5, AND 1.6.  .2-.6 showing the same episode of the X-Flies...................

 

There was alot of tropo on 1/2/05. I was able to pick up 5-1, 5-2, 9-1 ,9-2,11-1,11-2,and 32-1 from chicago for a few hours that day. Im in Slinger, Wis. Even the best hdtv recievers don't work when they are recieving 2 different channels on the same frequency.

[Greg Oman]

Even the best hdtv recievers don't work when they are recieving 2 different channels on the same frequency.

Keep in mind where we are in the digital TV transition here.  All stations are still currently sending their analog signals in their assigned frequency ranges.  The psip stream (a digital text field) is not necessarily required to be the actual channel frequency.  WDJT here apparently thinks they have a marketing coup here by grabbing psip of Channel 1.  They actually are broadcasting analog on 58 and digital on 46.  The rest of the local stations here have their psip streams matching their analog frequencies (such as 4.1 is WTMJ, 6.1 is WITI for example).

It is expected that most if not all stations will revert back to their analog frequency ranges with a digital transmission after the transition is complete.  This is mostly due to branding... TV stations spend a lot of energy thinking about how to get you to know their jingles, media personalities, channel numbers, etc. as it usually translates into people watching.  Number of viewers drives everything.

Anyway, back to my real point, I doubt the issues were due to Tropo.  Yes, I'm familiar with that phenomonom.  Here's why I disagree.  Look at the actual channels (which can be correleated to actual broadcast spectrum frequencies quite easily) and you'll see that there is PLENTY of frequency separation between the stations in nearby cities:

Chicago:
Analog              Station             Digital
2                       WBBM (CBS)    3
5                       WMAQ             29
7                       WLS                52
9                       WGN                19
11                     WTTW              47

Milwaukee:
4                       WTMJ               28
6                       WITI                33
10                     WMVS              8
12                     WISN               34
58                     WDJT (CBS)      46

Madison:
3                       WKOW (CBS)   50

So, you can see that the CBS affiliates are sufficiently separated in terms of broadcast frequencies.

The signal drops are just that, signal drops as each of those subchannels takes away available bandwidth from the assigned range.  We typically see the 19Mbit wide range needing 12-14Mbit's for a perfect 1080i or 720p picture.  While I don't know what the allocation was on this particular day, the fact that I had signals and content on each subchannel means bandwidth that could have been used for the main CBS 58 channel was being used elsewhere.  When the "pipe" isn't big enough to accomodate the signal, something gets left out.  Sometimes it's picture elements, sometimes it's multichannel sound.

Greg O.

[smack]

Well the temp has dropped below 15 degrees again and I have no CBS (again)

Anyone have any ideas on what this might be?  is it an antenna problem, a connection problem or?  I have an attic mounted antenna that usually brings in 58-1 @ 69% in warmer weather (30 degrees plus).  

When it gets 15-20 degrees or below I get 0% with it jumping up to 20% for a split second.

I have two antennas in the attic.  I know one of them receives 10-1 (it lays down on the floor of the attic) and the other is hung in the rafters.  

Which one would 58-1 (1-1, cbs or whatever) come in on?  

Is signal strength the problem?  I called Larry @ Kemmer to ask him (he did install, great job too!!) But can anyone help in the meantime?

smack

[foxeng]

Originally posted by Greg Oman
The psip stream (a digital text field) is not necessarily required to be the actual channel frequency.  WDJT here apparently thinks they have a marketing coup here by grabbing psip of Channel 1.  

The new PSIP law requires all stations to use their analog channel as their virtual channel number. Those stations who do not have an analog channel number must use their actual channel number and for those stations yet to be licensed that might come on an actual channel that someone else onced used and is using it for their virtual channel, then they have to pick something between 2 and 51 that isn't in use in the local area.