Speaker Upgrade

[Steve Mann]

HFC! I just had to tell someone.  

I just completed my order at Axiom Speakers . Come this Friday, thanks to part of my early tax return, I should be the proud owner of a pair of M60ti towers, one VP150 center speaker and two QS4 surrounds. These will be put in to service with my SVS 20-39cs sub to create a pretty decent soundstage I'm figuring.

I can't wait... this should be a pretty substantial upgrade over my current Boston Acoustics.  

[Pat]

Here's a "guy thing" (especially for "guy movies" and concert DVDs) that women appreciate that you should consider if your wallet still has some heft to it.

We added a "sound transducer" to the floor and consider it the best change we've ever made to the sound system.  There are several brands available, including "Clark" out of Colorado, "Butt Kicker", and one other that I can't think of.

Anyway, when amplified and carrying the LFE channel, the LOW LOW base is transferred to whatever its attached to.  In my case, its the floor, and the resulting kick is transferred to all seating positions.

There's no comparison between watching the first part of Saving Private Ryan with this unit and without.  (We do have a substantial (~ 1000 watts, 7.1 sound system as well, of course.)  You practically have a heart attack, watching it.  Most concerts are VERY nice as well -- you can feel the big drums.

Women like it because the sound level itself need not be ear-shattering (although that's good too!) to get the effect.

The Clark that I have was $500 plus an amp to drive it.  Wouldn't work well on a concrete floor, of course, but can be hooked up to furniture, as can the other brands.

[Steve Mann]

Thanks for the suggestion, Pat. I've considered tactile transducers before, but never went ahead with them. It is something I'll certainly consider. With my SVS 20-39cs and Samson 700 amp in my mid-sized room, I get a lot of physical 'impact' already. It would however be nice to have the same effect at lower volumes as you mentioned.

I'm currently only using one side of the Samson, so I would already have the amp half of the equation if I do decide to go that route.

Thanks again for the idea.

[Matt Heebner]

I am jealous! This years tax return goes to the wife cause I got it all last year. I have been drooling over new speakers (Paradigm Studio 40's and the Studio CC) and an upgrade to seperates (thinkin about Rotel or ATI) but can't pull the trigger yet (damn conscience).
Did get myself a Monster Power Center HTS3500, but still too early to judge the effect whether positive or negative on my system yet. For a snap judgement, I'd say it's preety good but have to spend more time with it still.

Have fun with your new purchases...

Matt

[Steve Mann]

Dang it! There's been a delay in my delivery. I contacted Fedex this morning to see what the holdup was with information on my shipment on their tracking page. It wasn't updating. I was informed that the shipment had been held in Tennessee by Customs. They were requesting an Importer's ID number. In this case, that is just my SS#. So... they faxed over a form and I've faxed it back. Now it looks like I won't be getting the delivery until Monday.  

Seems this is a 'random' procedure and I was just the 'lucky one' this time. :rolleyes: Axiom said that this has only happened to about 5 of their shipments to the US out of all they have sent.

I guess this is just one of the hazards with the 'direct to consumer' business model. Especially when dealing with International companies.

Looks like I'm in for a disappointing weekend. Damn. I was all prepared to spend HOURS upon HOURS tweaking and listening.

[Mike Sheahan]

That looks like it will be a beautiful setup!  What a nice accompanyment for the SVS sub.

Be sure to let us know what you think when you get them all tuned in.

[Steve Mann]

Originally posted by Mike Sheahan
That looks like it will be a beautiful setup!  What a nice accompanyment for the SVS sub.

Be sure to let us know what you think when you get them all tuned in.

Thanks... I'm thinking the same thing. They should really compliment each other.  

According to the tracking page, the speakers are on the truck for delivery. I wish I would have remembered to have them delivered to work, instead of home. Now I'm going to have to play 'tag' with the Fedex delivery guy. I'm going to leave a little early from work. If I'm lucky, the Fedex guy won't have been there yet. If I'm not, I'll have to go over and pick them up at the facility. Problem there is I'll have to wait till after 5 or so when the guy makes it back there and drops them off.  

Either way, it should be a late night tonight.  

[Steve Mann]

Old setup:
Sony STR-DE545 Dolby/DTS Receiver
Boston Acoustic CR-6s for fronts and surrounds.
Boston Acoustic VR920 Center
Generic 'Acoustic Studio Monitor 3312s' (B-channel speakers)
SVS 20-39cs Sub with Samson 700 amp

New setup:
Sony STR-DE545 Dolby/DTS Receiver
Axiom M60ti towers for fronts
Axiom QS4 surround speakers
Axiom VP150 center speaker
SVS 20-39cs Sub with Samson 700 amp

Axiom Web Site: http://www.axiomaudio.com/

Rough, unedited images of the uninstalled speakers and their packaging can be seen here: ftp://steve-mann.com/ . I intend on updating my Theater page on my web site soon to reflect the Axiom additions.

The new Axiom speakers are a making a great first impression. While I've been actively involved in music, both listening and creating (made a career in a band for over 7 years), I'm by no means as versed in speaker technology as many are. I'm still an audiophile wannabe. However, I'll try and give my best informative review.

The speakers are extremely well made, each being quite hefty for it's size. Each and every speaker was perfect. Even though they are a 'veneer' outer finish, they look very 'classy'. I purchased the black ones, so the finer points of their appearance are somewhat subdued. No scratches, misaligned corners or imperfections at all that I could find. The tower speakers came with feet or carpet spikes for whichever application you might have in your home.

The only 'issue' I ran into was that I had my old surround speakers on stands. Not thinking correctly, I assumed I would just use the same stands for the QS4s. I forgot to consider that since they were quad-pole, they would need to be open on the bottom. So, that led to a bit of a longer than expected install. I used the enclosed speaker brackets and mounted the surrounds on the sidewalls of my 'theater' in approximately the same position the old ones where on their stands. My only concern is that they are too close to the back wall, thus causing some reflection of the one tweeter. So far though, I have not really noticed and negative effects.

Now, lets move on to more fun stuff. The sound! I was very anxious and had to wait longer that I originally planned before I was able listen to these beauties. I was well rewarded when I finally was able to. After using my Avia disk to balance all the speakers, I flipped on the power. My first thought; the Axioms are VERY clean sounding. There's not a bit of distortion even at levels higher than I'm used to listening at (which is pretty dang loud). In the past, I've never been able to reach these levels with the Boston Acoustic CR-6s. That's not really a far comparison as the CR-6s are not really in the same class, nor should they be expected to compete with the M60ti towers. Not to sell them short however, the BAs did a fine job in the past in providing an enjoyable home theater experience. They were a great entry point to the home theater 'hobby'.

So far I've listen to several movies scenes. I've noticed improvement in each. Dialog is clear, crisp and well defined. Imaging was much more defined. The overall 5.1 sound field was more enveloping. The M60s go very deep. I was more than surprised at how low they can go. In 5.1 mode, they complement my SVS sub beautifully, in 2-channel mode for music CDs, they offer a big, full sounding bass that is very tight and true to the source. I hardly missed the sub at all in this application.

Speaking of the 2-channel sound field, I was overwhelmed while listening to several different genres of music on the second night. I sampled songs from Sara Mclachlan, Dire Straits and some new(er) Dokken. The latter kicked as I thought it would. There was no lack of bass and SPL levels were at a very impressive level with no distortion. Sara and Dire Straits impressed even more. I heard parts in sounds that I had never noticed before. The highs were so crisp, but not harsh at all. Mid-range was well reproduced and vocals were clear, stood out and were on top of the music as they were intended to be. Some had cautioned that the Axioms could be considered 'harsh' or to 'bright'. I didn't find this the case in my application at all.

It's only been a short number of days since I've had these speakers. However, I think it's more than safe to say that I will enjoy these babies for a long time to come. I'm planning a receiver upgrade in the near future, so I expect that to even draw more performance out of these already impressive speakers. I'm going to enjoy these more and more every day, I'm sure.

[Mike Sheahan]

Great review.  

I ran into a few of the same situations you mentioned when I had to find a place for my surrounds, but I must say that having them mounted to the wall really makes them sound the way the are supposed to.

I think you will find that as the towers "break-in" over a month or so the sound will begin to smooth out a bit.  My Klipsch speakers did as well, and at first I really didn't want them too beceause I couldn't believe how great they sounded, but if you can believe this, they do sound even better now than they did fresh out of the box.

Did you set your fronts to large, or do you have it all set small?  You might want to try playing with different settings in that reguard, and just for fun, you may be surrprised how different it will make your system sound when you have them all set to large.  In the end I left my surrounds and center set small, and the towers large.  I think it ballanced my system better because my SVS is in the back of my room behind the chairs, and I just couldn't justify cutting them off at 80Hz when they can go down to 37Hz.

Have fun messing around with them, and I know you are going to love them.  I don't care what anyone says about a system with small satellites and a good sub, because it will never compare to a great set of full range speakers and a SVS sub.

[Steve Mann]

Mike,

Thanks for your thoughts. I currently have the fronts on small when in 5.1 settings. I'm going to try setting them to large when I have some time this weekend to listen to the differences. I'm thinking LOTR should be a good test. I agree that it seems like a waste to have them set as small when they go down so low. I'm wondering does what is sent to the sub actually change when the fronts are set to large?

When I put the speakers in 2 channel mode, they get the full frequency and really kick. If I didn't know better, I could almost imagine the sub is on. CDs sound great on these. If they're going to sound better as they speakers break in, I'm going to be in heaven when that happens.

[jlegge]

How the receiver interpets what is going to be sent to the sub vs. the mains is primarily dependent on the settings (and how it is wired, but lets assume via LFE).

If you set the mains to small the receivers crossover is comes into play at a much higher frequency than if you set them to large. This capability was actually put in primarily for sattelite speaker packages, because the smaller speakers do not have any sort low frequency driver, and you do not want to blow your speakers.

If you have large speakers, and the receiver is set to large then each speaker will get the full range, as well as the .1 channel going to the subwoofer.

You do get greater performance out of large speakers set to large. However, it is a matter of preference. Try out both ways, give it a whirl, and see which you like better.

Oh, and I recommend either Star Wars Part II or Gladiator for sound tests and for video I would go with The Fifth Element or A Bugs Life (the kids get have fun while playing with that one!).

[Steve Mann]

John,

I do indeed have the sub wired using the LFE channel. Based on what you've said, it sounds like I'll get the same input to my sub no matter if I have the fronts set to large or small. That's good and kind of what I figured. I didn't have time to experiment last night, but I plan on doing lots of it tonight and over the weekend. My guess would be that I'll end up putting the fronts on large and leaving them there.

I have both Gladiator and Star Wars EII. They do indeed sound like some good 'test' DVDs. Another one is Dark City. It has some tremendous lows through out the picture.

Anyways, thanks for the info!

[Steve Mann]

As suggested, I've been playing around a bit setting the fronts (the M60s) to 'Small' and 'Large'. While on my system it seems to be a subtle difference, I do believe a fuller sound is achieved by having the speakers set to 'Large'.

As previously mentioned, the M60s go down to 37k so it seems wasteful to cut them off around 80k. My SVS sub still blends very nicely with the M60s as they reproduce the full spectrum being sent to them.

I just watched the entire 'Talking Heads: Stop Making Sense' DVD in Dolby 5.1 and through out the performance I was entirely pleased with the new Axioms. They continue to satisfy me more with each listening.

[Mike Sheahan]

Glad you like em Steve, that is what it is all about.

As for small and large settings, every receiver does it in its own way, and I'm not sure just how your Sony hangles it, but my Denon lets me pick each individual speaker to set as Large or small, and then asks if I have a Sub or not.  So I can actually set my mains as large, and still keep my Sub set for the LFE, or put the LFE through my mains and the Sub.  With the SVS, I have found it best to let it handle all the LFE duties, but I still leave the mains on Large to get a fuller sound upfront.

Have fun play'n with them, and remember, once you decide how you like them set, you should go through the calibration again to make sure that they are still all set to the same level.

[WaukeshaBADGER]

You guys really know your stuff (or you really have me fooled), I'll go with the former. I have Polk 6700 series speakers and 303 sub. A great sounding system for the room I have my entertainment set up. My question is, in reading some of your thoughts, does the surround sound receiver make a lot of difference? I have the Yamaha 5540, which is low-mid level and it appears to shift the surround OK. However, while at a demo show saw the Sony 4ES and was quite impressed. In your opinion, would the upgrade in receiver make much difference?

Thanks in advance.